vpFREE2 Forums

The thrill is gone........

#1

Well, not completely. But it is getting harder and harder to get excited about taking several trips a year to LV as the cost of flying continues to rise and games and paytables are eliminated/changed.

Maybe it's the angst of seeing my retirement account drop close to 50% in the last year with the realization that I'm gonna have to work several more years than I had planned.

I'm not completely done, but whole experience is getting harder to enjoy. I'll pick and choose offers and go for a vacation a few times a year, but nothing like in the past. I will not "work" so hard at maintaining a high daily average in a few casinos just to keep offers coming. If they come, fine. If not I'll stay home.

Part of this is due to the casino attitudes toward the comiing Depression - cutting games and comps. It seems to me you should be courting good solid players, not nickel and dimeing them at every chance. If I want to feel like that I'll go to Disney World!

As this economic mess deepens it will be interesting to see what happens. Talk about betting on the come - the big corporations have built like there was no tomorrow, and now they are beginning to feel the effects of their drunken, tourist driven orgy.

Am I alone here? There are 8000 people in this group - a good number of which are tourists like me. Are you feeling anything like me?

Sigh.....

Jigger

"On some days, my head is filled with such wild and original thoughts
that I can barely utter a word. On other days, the liquor store is
closed."

"Sex is like air. It's not important unless you aren't getting any."

"No one ever says "It's only a game,"
when their team is winning."

"Ever notice that people who spend money on beer,
cigarettes, and video poker are always complaining
about being broke and not feeling well?"

#2

Am I alone here? There are 8000 people in this group - a good number of which are

tourists like me. Are you feeling anything like me?

Sigh.....

Jigger

On the other side of the coin, speaking for my wife and me, we are still very excited about
VP, even though we have been at it a bit more than 10 years now (maybe not nearly as
long as you). We still look forward to 4-5 trips a year to LV, with some intermediate trips
to Bossier City, LA. Right now, we are "locked in" for a Thanksgiving trip and one over
Super Bowl weekend.

We do watch carefully where and what we play and, to some extent, that is part of the fun.
The challenge is still there, to play a lot and have room, meals, and drinks paid for (except
for tips).

Anyway, you did ask...

..... bl

···

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, Jigger Woodruff <bayfieldkent@...> wrote:

#3

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, Jigger Woodruff <bayfieldkent@...>
wrote:

Part of this is due to the casino attitudes toward the comiing

Depression - cutting games and comps. It seems to me you should be
courting good solid players, not nickel and dimeing them at every
chance. If I want to feel like that I'll go to Disney World!

I predict that many casinos will keep cutting and cutting until they
run off all of their medium / big players and turn into nothing but a
overgrown slot grind house full of nickel bettors playing Alien and
Lion Fish. And yes, I agree that this is exactly opposite what
they "should" do, but casino management types have never struck me as
being particularly logical.

EE

#4

Jigger

I'm a tourist who still enjoys VP. It is certainly much harder than
it was back in 2002 when I started, no question about it. I've found
I have to be more picky about where I play. Having said that 2007 and
2008 so far are the best two profit years I've ever had (mainly due to
a bump up to dollars).

The B-Connected downtown sucks, but I'll still give MSS a few trips
before I give up on them. Perhaps the Free play will increase? Or we
will get some x5 and x6 points days to make up some of the lost cash
back? As long as the Silver and Gold and Scratch cards are available
it's still a play.

I figure there's a few more years of good plays out there for us
tourists before it will become a run and gun locals only market.

Well, not completely. But it is getting harder and harder to get

excited about taking several trips a year to LV as the cost of flying
continues to rise and games and paytables are eliminated/changed.

Maybe it's the angst of seeing my retirement account drop close to

50% in the last year with the realization that I'm gonna have to work
several more years than I had planned.

I'm not completely done, but whole experience is getting harder to

enjoy. I'll pick and choose offers and go for a vacation a few times
a year, but nothing like in the past. I will not "work" so hard at
maintaining a high daily average in a few casinos just to keep offers
coming. If they come, fine. If not I'll stay home.

Part of this is due to the casino attitudes toward the comiing

Depression - cutting games and comps. It seems to me you should be
courting good solid players, not nickel and dimeing them at every
chance. If I want to feel like that I'll go to Disney World!

As this economic mess deepens it will be interesting to see what

happens. Talk about betting on the come - the big corporations have
built like there was no tomorrow, and now they are beginning to feel
the effects of their drunken, tourist driven orgy.

Am I alone here? There are 8000 people in this group - a good

number of which are tourists like me. Are you feeling anything like me?

···

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, Jigger Woodruff <bayfieldkent@...> wrote:

Sigh.....

Jigger

"On some days, my head is filled with such wild and original thoughts
that I can barely utter a word. On other days, the liquor store is
closed."

"Sex is like air. It's not important unless you aren't getting any."

"No one ever says "It's only a game,"
when their team is winning."

"Ever notice that people who spend money on beer,
cigarettes, and video poker are always complaining
about being broke and not feeling well?"

#5

Definitely the thrill is going away Especially with the small profit margin (if any) of today's video poker and that the math tells me that I will take a pretty good hit without some top line hits.

Las Vegas is fun but with the high cost of getting there, I might as well take the money for transportation and use that to subsidize a local playing opportunity where I can take advantage of all offers.

http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/msnnkwxp1020093175mrt/direct/01/

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

#6

Hard Rock Hotel has 25 cent pNSUD in the High Limit room. There is one machine located on a bank of 8 slat tops.

···

To: vpFREE@yahoogroups.com
From: waynes@kiwiplan.com
Date: Mon, 13 Oct 2008 21:38:32 +0000
Subject: [vpFREE] Re: The thrill is gone........

.
          
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

#7

the big corporations have built like there was no tomorrow, and now
they are beginning to feel the effects of their drunken, tourist
driven orgy.

Which property? I'm still waiting for my Drunken Tourist Driven Orgy
offer so I can work out the expected value.

Years ago I made the schlepp to Vegas 4 times a year. The schlepp has
gotten to be more uncomfortable, more uncertain and more expensive.
The value at other destinations has increased while the value of Las
Vegas plays has declined. Once so far this year.

PS
Don't sweat the stock loss. Opportunity knocks. As an American
citizen you are going to become part owner of half the banks in the
country.

Chandler

···

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, Jigger Woodruff <bayfieldkent@...> wrote:

#8

This weekend I am celebrating my recent divorce with a gambling trip. I looked at Vegas, but with the hassle of a cross-country trip, plus knowing the bad games available on the Strip, why bother? I'll make the 3 hour drive to Tunica and enjoy $5 tables and FP VP while I sleep in my comped room and feast on the comped buffet (which offers yummy Corky's BBQ and free beer). Even in Tunica the offers are getting worse and worse from HET. Give credit to Boyd - this will be the first multiday trip I have stayed and played exclusively at Sam's Town. The reason is simple - great offers and better odds.

···

--- On Mon, 10/13/08, cmayhem2001 <chandler_re@comcast.net> wrote:

From: cmayhem2001 <chandler_re@comcast.net>
Subject: [vpFREE] Re: The thrill is gone........
To: vpFREE@yahoogroups.com
Date: Monday, October 13, 2008, 7:10 PM

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups. com, Jigger Woodruff <bayfieldkent@ ...> wrote:

the big corporations have built like there was no tomorrow, and now
they are beginning to feel the effects of their drunken, tourist
driven orgy.

Which property? I'm still waiting for my Drunken Tourist Driven Orgy
offer so I can work out the expected value.

Years ago I made the schlepp to Vegas 4 times a year. The schlepp has
gotten to be more uncomfortable, more uncertain and more expensive.
The value at other destinations has increased while the value of Las
Vegas plays has declined. Once so far this year.

PS
Don't sweat the stock loss. Opportunity knocks. As an American
citizen you are going to become part owner of half the banks in the
country.

Chandler

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

#9

GOOD POINT.

I sure miss the .6% CB at Mirage. When Mirage was home base; a mini
suite, gormet meals and up front show tickets were the norm. I miss
the $1 JOB progs. with entry level play at about 9G. I miss the
different times when Mirage had some 9/6 JOB. I remember fondly the
western game that was 3 line and played that good music. Also, the 2
$2 JOB that lasted a yr or two. I miss cashing a seven-eight hundred
dollar CB check for a long week at Mirage. Nice going home bonus;
especially if my bankroll tanked.

I miss the two $1 FPDW at Frontier; back in the days when there ws no
internet and not many folks played vp with zest. There was no CB but
that was ok. I also really liked the Frontier 6 coin quarter progs.
When Frontier was home base and I always go about 8 hours play a day.
That left another 8 hrs to be tourist. Nice thing about Frontier then
was 4 hrs of quarter play would net me a comp room. One hour of $1
play gave me 23 hours to be tourist.

These are just a couple examples. There were good plays all over town.

Alas; times change......Jeep

Definitely the thrill is going away Especially with the small

profit margin (if any) of today's video poker and that the math tells
me that I will take a pretty good hit without some top line hits.

Las Vegas is fun but with the high cost of getting there, I might as

well take the money for transportation and use that to subsidize a
local playing opportunity where I can take advantage of all offers.

···

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, kelso 1600 <kelso1600@...> wrote:

http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/msnnkwxp1020093175mrt/direct/01/

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

#10

Definitely the thrill is going away Especially with the small

profit margin (if any) of today's video poker and that the math tells
me that I will take a pretty good hit without some top line hits.

Las Vegas is fun but with the high cost of getting there, I might

as well take the money for transportation and use that to subsidize a
local playing opportunity where I can take advantage of all offers.

I still enjoy my trips to Vegas and am not looking for a profit
margin when I am playing VP. I only play 9/6 JOB or NSUD at the $
level, recognizing that this is a loser, and make the trip because I
enjoy the environment, food and escape. Places where I used to play
have become off limits for me now (Venetian, Bellagio, TI, Caesar's,
LVH, Paris etc.) because they have removed all of the playable VP for
my level of play except for LVH, and LVH is way too proud of what
they have to offer. I used to drop in at V every trip for a few hours
of play (generally about 25-30K through) and a nice comped meal, but
no more. It seems that I receive at least one mailing a week from V,
but since their games have gone downhill, I just have no interest in
going there. A few years back I would go to Vegas 8-12 times a year
for 3 days at a time, and always took $10K as my playing bankroll,
which I still do, and I am willing to lose that on a weekend. I
thought that I am the type of tourist-player that the casinos would
like to have, but apparently I am not their market. I have not been
there in 2008 at all, although my wife and I are going for a few days
right after Christmas. Along with the decrease in play opportunities,
the airfare and airport hassles are keeping me out of Vegas. I still
take Harrah's up on some of their junket trips and offers out of
Houston and find them quite enjoyable. Also go to NOLA, Lake Charles
and Shreveport from time to time and get all the play I want in those
venues. If anyone cares about my situation, I would be amazed, but I
just wanted to rant a little.
Well deserved congrats to TomSki--one of the nicest people in this
business where there are a lot of nice people.
Spread a little cheer.
Ozymandias

···

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, kelso 1600 <kelso1600@...> wrote:

#11

You know, despite on going downgrades I still find myself going out
there the same rate as normal (10-12 times per year). I tend to play
games that are "good," but not profitable (9/6 JOB, Pick 'Em if I want
to build points and get free drinks for a long time) with the
exception of a little 10/7 DB.

But I don't go for profit. I go expecting to donate a "little" to
entertainment, at the hope that I get decent drink service and some
comps to make me feel better about my donation (doesn't have to be
greater than my donation). I go for the atmosphere, the adult escape.

I hate to say it, but it would take a lot more downgrades for me to
stop going out to Vegas for fun. As long as there's some 9/6 JOB
available, decent comps (which are still out there), and decent drink
service (which I still seem to get), I will continue to make my trips
out there.

Who knows, in 5 years this might not exist and I will no longer be a
Vegas patron.

···

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "ozymandias77096" <ugwf@...> wrote:

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, kelso 1600 <kelso1600@> wrote:
>
> Definitely the thrill is going away Especially with the small
profit margin (if any) of today's video poker and that the math tells
me that I will take a pretty good hit without some top line hits.
> Las Vegas is fun but with the high cost of getting there, I might
as well take the money for transportation and use that to subsidize a
local playing opportunity where I can take advantage of all offers.
>
>
>

I still enjoy my trips to Vegas and am not looking for a profit
margin when I am playing VP. I only play 9/6 JOB or NSUD at the $
level, recognizing that this is a loser, and make the trip because I
enjoy the environment, food and escape. Places where I used to play
have become off limits for me now (Venetian, Bellagio, TI, Caesar's,
LVH, Paris etc.) because they have removed all of the playable VP for
my level of play except for LVH, and LVH is way too proud of what
they have to offer. I used to drop in at V every trip for a few hours
of play (generally about 25-30K through) and a nice comped meal, but
no more. It seems that I receive at least one mailing a week from V,
but since their games have gone downhill, I just have no interest in
going there. A few years back I would go to Vegas 8-12 times a year
for 3 days at a time, and always took $10K as my playing bankroll,
which I still do, and I am willing to lose that on a weekend. I
thought that I am the type of tourist-player that the casinos would
like to have, but apparently I am not their market. I have not been
there in 2008 at all, although my wife and I are going for a few days
right after Christmas. Along with the decrease in play opportunities,
the airfare and airport hassles are keeping me out of Vegas. I still
take Harrah's up on some of their junket trips and offers out of
Houston and find them quite enjoyable. Also go to NOLA, Lake Charles
and Shreveport from time to time and get all the play I want in those
venues. If anyone cares about my situation, I would be amazed, but I
just wanted to rant a little.
Well deserved congrats to TomSki--one of the nicest people in this
business where there are a lot of nice people.
Spread a little cheer.
Ozymandias

#12

tourists like me. Are you feeling anything like me?

I have been coming to Las Vegas from Canada for over thirty years and seen it at it's
tawdriest and at it's best. I have loved it, hated it, embraced it,rejected it, stayed at the
best hotels and some of the worst, lost heavily there, won a lot there,been lonely
there,been loved and surrounded by friends and family there,have seen some amazing
shows there, have seen some real dreck there,had amazing meals there and was sicker
than a dog with buffet food poisoning there.

Yes I have sometimes felt the thrill was gone and went looking for it in other places.
However it is only a matter of time before I return because in spite of all the other places
one can go to... and I don't want to sound like a chamber of commerce cliche... there really
is no other place on earth like Las Vegas.

I may go less times because of the economy, higher cost of flying,less attractive offers and
with a smaller bankroll, but I will keep on going.

I still get a thrill when I hit a four of a kind with a kicker or a royal or a hand-pay. Double
the thrill if it happens in Vegas.

Cheers,

MO

···

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, Jigger Woodruff <bayfieldkent@...> wrote:

> Am I alone here? There are 8000 people in this group - a good number of which are

#13

Hi Mo!

You have expressed my sentiments exactly. I have also felt every
emotion that you so eloquently describe below. From elation to
depression with every range of feelings in between those moods.

The bottom line is that I still LOVE Las Vegas (Reno also,
though not nearly as well) treasure every trip that I am fortunate
enough to be able to take, and will continue to visit as often as
I have in the past.

I have been rewarded for my loyalty to LV, by still being able to
find good plays, for my level of action, on every trip. This
sometimes requires a little extra scouting and researching, prior to
planning a trip. But, for me at least, that's part of the challenge
and adds to my enjoyment and sense of satisfaction.

So, for now at least, it's still Viva Las Vegas!

~Babe~

···

==================================
--In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "mofromto2" <mike69tigg@...> wrote:

I have been coming to Las Vegas from Canada for over
thirty years and seen it at it's tawdriest and at it's best.
I have loved it, hated it, embraced it,rejected it, stayed at
the best hotels and some of the worst, lost heavily there, won a
lot there,been lonely there,been loved and surrounded by friends
and family there,have seen some amazing shows there, have seen
some real dreck there,had amazing meals there and was sicker
than a dog with buffet food poisoning there........

Yes I have sometimes felt the thrill was gone and went looking for
it in other places. However it is only a matter of time before I
return because in spite of all the other places one can go to...
and I don't want to sound like a chamber of commerce cliche...
there really is no other place on earth like Las Vegas........

#14

PS
Don't sweat the stock loss. Opportunity knocks. As an
American
citizen you are going to become part owner of half the
banks in the
country.

···

--- On Mon, 10/13/08, cmayhem2001 <chandler_re@comcast.net> wrote:
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Good point! I've always wanted to be in banking - cool!

Will we now be known as the USSRA?

United States Socialist Republic of America.....

#15

It's not like it used to be, but it's still about the only place I
can vacation where my hotel, food and entertainment is free and I
have a decent chance of coming home with more money than I took.
Everywhere else I go, they want me to pay for everything!

Bob

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "jackessiebabe" <jackessiebabe@...>
wrote:

Hi Mo!

You have expressed my sentiments exactly. I have also felt every
emotion that you so eloquently describe below. From elation to
depression with every range of feelings in between those moods.

The bottom line is that I still LOVE Las Vegas (Reno also,
though not nearly as well) treasure every trip that I am fortunate
enough to be able to take, and will continue to visit as often as
I have in the past.

I have been rewarded for my loyalty to LV, by still being able to
find good plays, for my level of action, on every trip. This
sometimes requires a little extra scouting and researching, prior

to

planning a trip. But, for me at least, that's part of the

challenge

···

and adds to my enjoyment and sense of satisfaction.

So, for now at least, it's still Viva Las Vegas!

~Babe~

#16

GOOD POINT.

I sure miss the .6% CB at Mirage. When Mirage was home base; a mini
suite, gormet meals and up front show tickets were the norm. I miss
the $1 JOB progs. with entry level play at about 9G. I miss the
different times when Mirage had some 9/6 JOB. I remember fondly the
western game that was 3 line and played that good music. Also, the

2

$2 JOB that lasted a yr or two. I miss cashing a seven-eight

hundred

dollar CB check for a long week at Mirage.

If you can see me right now I am pointing my finger directly at
casino marketing for the abyss they have created.

Yes, that few hundred from cash back here and there did make a
substantial difference, if only psychological. You felt like you were
going home with SOMETHING, and at least your cab fare and other small
expenses were easily covered.

I share many of your Mirage memories but was also fiercely loyal to
Caesars Palace and had lots of fun meals with family at the Palatium
Buffet. Lots of NSUD and 9/6 Jacks awaited.

But you can't live in the past. The casinos now are all about
unplayable games and overpriced retail/food, even the buffets
themselves. Corporate types dictate that your offers stop if you
manage to win (see the many Wynn posts earlier to learn how winning
on their full-pays will quickly shut the door on you).

Personally, I have one or two trips planned this year for the
shopping events many of you will also attend. But as for 2009, I
expect most, if not all, of my play to remain in California.

Mikey

···

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "whitejeeps" <whitejeeps@...> wrote:

#17

of which are tourists like me. Are you feeling anything like me?

Yuo're not alone. My wife and I both agree that the allure of Vegas is
fading fast. It started with the demise of two of our favourites, the
Barbary Coast and Las Vegas Hilton. Now another one, Main Street
Station, where we are well established, looks to be on a downslide.

We have other places where we can play video poker. The pay scales are
not quite as good as Vegas, but when you factor in the cost of getting
to Vegas (and staying there), they are competitive.

This year (2008) will be the first one since 1991, when we started
going to Vegas, that we do not set foot there.

···

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, Jigger Woodruff <bayfieldkent@...> wrote:

Am I alone here? There are 8000 people in this group - a good number

#18

I got to agree with Babe & Mo, but I have to substitute Reno for LV.

I've always tried to avoid the herds and the herd mentality. When
attendance is down, you become a relatively bigger fish in the smaller
pond.

The air travel experience in general has degraded: delays & crowds at
the airports, fares up a bit with decreased # of flights offered and
full or near-full aircraft. Casinos are scrimping on comps & VP
paytables, true also in general. Reno has been hard-hit by the slowed
economy , but...

The good news is the Reno airport is never crowded, there are still
full-pay paytables and there's glitz & glamor if that's what turns
your crank. As my buddy says- it's just ME & My Machine.... meaning
you just want to sit and focus on the game in a relaxing environment.
I can still find that piece of heaven despite the extra "hurdles"....

~MARK

--babe wrote:

···

Hi Mo!

You have expressed my sentiments exactly. I have also felt every
emotion that you so eloquently describe below. From elation to
depression with every range of feelings in between those moods.

The bottom line is that I still LOVE Las Vegas (Reno also,
though not nearly as well) treasure every trip that I am fortunate
enough to be able to take, and will continue to visit as often as
I have in the past.

I have been rewarded for my loyalty to LV, by still being able to
find good plays, for my level of action, on every trip. This
sometimes requires a little extra scouting and researching, prior to
planning a trip. But, for me at least, that's part of the challenge
and adds to my enjoyment and sense of satisfaction.

So, for now at least, it's still Viva Las Vegas!

~Babe~

--mo wrote:

I have been coming to Las Vegas from Canada for over
thirty years and seen it at it's tawdriest and at it's best.
I have loved it, hated it, embraced it,rejected it, stayed at
the best hotels and some of the worst, lost heavily there, won a
lot there,been lonely there,been loved and surrounded by friends
and family there,have seen some amazing shows there, have seen
some real dreck there,had amazing meals there and was sicker
than a dog with buffet food poisoning there........

Yes I have sometimes felt the thrill was gone and went looking for
it in other places. However it is only a matter of time before I
return because in spite of all the other places one can go to...
and I don't want to sound like a chamber of commerce cliche...
there really is no other place on earth like Las Vegas........

#19

I will admit that Vegas spoils you. I recently spent a weekend in Oklahoma City and paid $105/night at a Holiday Inn Express. I never have paid more than $59 in Vegas (except once at the Wynn, I paid $119)

I will go back to Vegas but with less enthusiasm than before.

Chetkl

   
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

#20

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Bob Montgomery" <fourqueens1954@...>
wrote:

It's not like it used to be, but it's still about the only place I
can vacation where my hotel, food and entertainment is free and I
have a decent chance of coming home with more money than I took.
Everywhere else I go, they want me to pay for everything!

Bob

I'm with you, Bob. Try staying at any resort or take a cruise for $0
for rooms and very close to that for food for 12 nights. Plus the
chance that you'll go home with more cash than you came with. Won't
happen!

Pam