What would you have done?

[Karen_Beno]

Last year my friend and I were playing VP at our home
casino when a guy sitting behind us won a large
jackpot on another VP machine. He was paid and happily
left.

A little while later, someone else sat down at this
machine. He did not play. Apparently, the casino
employee who paid the jackpot winner, had forgotten to
register the win on the machine as "paid". Therefore
it looked like the guy who was now sitting at the
machine had won this jackpot and was waiting for his
pay.

Sure enough after a couple of minutes an employee came
by, congratulated the "winner" and went off to get the
money. Soon he came back with more employees in tow
because somehow the "win" wasn't registering in their
computer. After a while five or six different
employees were standing around the "winner", including
a supervisor. When it became clear that they were
ready to pay the "winner" because they couldn't find
out what was wrong, my friend and I had to decide what
to do.

We did not know the "winner". We did know all of the
casino employees who all had been working there for
years. The employee who paid the real winner, was one
of the nicest people working in the casino. He often
took care of us with free drinks (in this casino
normally only high rollers, which we are not, get free
drinks). He was likely to get part of the blame for
the mistake of not registering the pay if they found
out later what went wrong.

On the other hand, if the guy who was trying to hustle
the casino realized who tipped off the employees, he
and his friends might not take too kindly towards us.
We didn't want our heads bashed in when we left later
that night! Plus it seemed the "winner" had not
deliberately set out to get the money that didn't
belong to him; had possibly not even noticed where he
sat down. He just didn't say "no" when someone walked
by, saw the win and offered to get him cash! And on
the third hand, we weren't without sin ourselves
having profited years ago from a computer malfunction
regarding points which lasted for months (and after
they fixed it, the same malfunction happened again a
year later and lasted AGAIN for months - it was a
mistake that benefit many if not all patrons and
nobody ever got called on it afterwards as far as we
know).

My friend and I weren't sure we were the only ones who
realized what was going on, but no-one else
intervened. Finally we made a decision. My friend
stealthily tugged the sleeve of one of the employees
we knew and whispered that this jackpot had already
been paid to someone else. The employee immediately
left with the supervisor. They went back to the
computer, talked briefly and came back to question the
"winner" in a far less friendly tone than they had
before. Before long they asked the guy to accompany
them to a backroom and that was the end of it.

Later that evening we were given an unlimited comp
voucher for dinner and drinks in the restaurant
(again, something quite extra-ordinary as this casino
doesn't give out food or beverages as comps except to
high rollers). While we were happy to receive the comp
and did accept it (free food is free food after all)
we did feel somewhat awkward about it; it felt a bit
like we were getting rewarded for squealing.

···

___________________________________________________________
Copy addresses and emails from any email account to Yahoo! Mail - quick, easy and free. http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/trueswitch2.html

[Myra_Andrews]

Karen, I think you and your friend did the right and honourable
thing. Good for you! Some employees may have gotten into a lot of
trouble if who had been passive and said nothing. What that guy was
doing was sleazy (and he may have been committing a fraud).

By giving you and your friend a free dinner the casino was letting
you know that they appreciated what you did.

Myra

···

On 8-Aug-06, at 5:12 PM, Karen Beno wrote:

Last year my friend and I were playing VP at our home
casino when a guy sitting behind us won a large
jackpot on another VP machine. He was paid and happily
left.

A little while later, someone else sat down at this
machine. He did not play. Apparently, the casino
employee who paid the jackpot winner, had forgotten to
register the win on the machine as "paid". Therefore
it looked like the guy who was now sitting at the
machine had won this jackpot and was waiting for his
pay.

Sure enough after a couple of minutes an employee came
by, congratulated the "winner" and went off to get the
money. Soon he came back with more employees in tow
because somehow the "win" wasn't registering in their
computer. After a while five or six different
employees were standing around the "winner", including
a supervisor. When it became clear that they were
ready to pay the "winner" because they couldn't find
out what was wrong, my friend and I had to decide what
to do.

We did not know the "winner". We did know all of the
casino employees who all had been working there for
years. The employee who paid the real winner, was one
of the nicest people working in the casino. He often
took care of us with free drinks (in this casino
normally only high rollers, which we are not, get free
drinks). He was likely to get part of the blame for
the mistake of not registering the pay if they found
out later what went wrong.

On the other hand, if the guy who was trying to hustle
the casino realized who tipped off the employees, he
and his friends might not take too kindly towards us.
We didn't want our heads bashed in when we left later
that night! Plus it seemed the "winner" had not
deliberately set out to get the money that didn't
belong to him; had possibly not even noticed where he
sat down. He just didn't say "no" when someone walked
by, saw the win and offered to get him cash! And on
the third hand, we weren't without sin ourselves
having profited years ago from a computer malfunction
regarding points which lasted for months (and after
they fixed it, the same malfunction happened again a
year later and lasted AGAIN for months - it was a
mistake that benefit many if not all patrons and
nobody ever got called on it afterwards as far as we
know).

My friend and I weren't sure we were the only ones who
realized what was going on, but no-one else
intervened. Finally we made a decision. My friend
stealthily tugged the sleeve of one of the employees
we knew and whispered that this jackpot had already
been paid to someone else. The employee immediately
left with the supervisor. They went back to the
computer, talked briefly and came back to question the
"winner" in a far less friendly tone than they had
before. Before long they asked the guy to accompany
them to a backroom and that was the end of it.

Later that evening we were given an unlimited comp
voucher for dinner and drinks in the restaurant
(again, something quite extra-ordinary as this casino
doesn't give out food or beverages as comps except to
high rollers). While we were happy to receive the comp
and did accept it (free food is free food after all)
we did feel somewhat awkward about it; it felt a bit
like we were getting rewarded for squealing.

__________________________________________________________
Copy addresses and emails from any email account to Yahoo! Mail -
quick, easy and free. http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/trueswitch2.html

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Albert_Pearson]

You were being rewarded for squealing.
That doesn't mean that squealing is not the right thing to do.

Regards
A.P.

···

----- Original Message ----- From: "Karen Beno" <karen_beno@yahoo.co.uk>
To: <vpFREE@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, August 08, 2006 8:12 PM
Subject: [vpFREE] re: What would you have done?

we did feel somewhat awkward about it; it felt a bit
like we were getting rewarded for squealing.

[Curtis_Rich]

It also does not mean that squealing was the right thing to do.

···

On 8/8/06, Albert Pearson <a-p@sympatico.ca> wrote:

You were being rewarded for squealing.
That doesn't mean that squealing is not the right thing to do.

Regards
A.P.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Karen Beno" <karen_beno@yahoo.co.uk>
To: <vpFREE@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, August 08, 2006 8:12 PM
Subject: [vpFREE] re: What would you have done?

> we did feel somewhat awkward about it; it felt a bit
> like we were getting rewarded for squealing.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Bill_Coleman1]

If honest citizens do not report crimes they witness then we have no
civilization. This wasn't some grey area, it was theft. Probably a
felony. Would you have committed the same crime? Or failed to report
it if you saw it?

And, by the way, reporting a crime you witness (even if you report it
while it is going on) is not squealing in my book. It is what you are
SUPPOSED to do.

···

At 02:08 PM 8/9/2006, you wrote:

It also does not mean that squealing was the right thing to do.

On 8/8/06, Albert Pearson <a-p@sympatico.ca> wrote:
>
> You were being rewarded for squealing.
> That doesn't mean that squealing is not the right thing to do.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[King_Fish]

If they hadn't reset the jackpot, then whatever credits the real winner had
when he hit the jackpot were still there.

After they reset the jackpot, did they cash out the remaining credits? Do
you know what happened to them?

Just curious.

···

On 8/8/06, Karen Beno <karen_beno@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:

Last year my friend and I were playing VP at our home
casino when a guy sitting behind us won a large
jackpot on another VP machine. He was paid and happily
left.

A little while later, someone else sat down at this
machine. He did not play. Apparently, the casino
employee who paid the jackpot winner, had forgotten to
register the win on the machine as "paid". Therefore
it looked like the guy who was now sitting at the
machine had won this jackpot and was waiting for his
pay.

Sure enough after a couple of minutes an employee came
by, congratulated the "winner" and went off to get the
money. Soon he came back with more employees in tow
because somehow the "win" wasn't registering in their
computer. After a while five or six different
employees were standing around the "winner", including
a supervisor. When it became clear that they were
ready to pay the "winner" because they couldn't find
out what was wrong, my friend and I had to decide what
to do.

We did not know the "winner". We did know all of the
casino employees who all had been working there for
years. The employee who paid the real winner, was one
of the nicest people working in the casino. He often
took care of us with free drinks (in this casino
normally only high rollers, which we are not, get free
drinks). He was likely to get part of the blame for
the mistake of not registering the pay if they found
out later what went wrong.

On the other hand, if the guy who was trying to hustle
the casino realized who tipped off the employees, he
and his friends might not take too kindly towards us.
We didn't want our heads bashed in when we left later
that night! Plus it seemed the "winner" had not
deliberately set out to get the money that didn't
belong to him; had possibly not even noticed where he
sat down. He just didn't say "no" when someone walked
by, saw the win and offered to get him cash! And on
the third hand, we weren't without sin ourselves
having profited years ago from a computer malfunction
regarding points which lasted for months (and after
they fixed it, the same malfunction happened again a
year later and lasted AGAIN for months - it was a
mistake that benefit many if not all patrons and
nobody ever got called on it afterwards as far as we
know).

My friend and I weren't sure we were the only ones who
realized what was going on, but no-one else
intervened. Finally we made a decision. My friend
stealthily tugged the sleeve of one of the employees
we knew and whispered that this jackpot had already
been paid to someone else. The employee immediately
left with the supervisor. They went back to the
computer, talked briefly and came back to question the
"winner" in a far less friendly tone than they had
before. Before long they asked the guy to accompany
them to a backroom and that was the end of it.

Later that evening we were given an unlimited comp
voucher for dinner and drinks in the restaurant
(again, something quite extra-ordinary as this casino
doesn't give out food or beverages as comps except to
high rollers). While we were happy to receive the comp
and did accept it (free food is free food after all)
we did feel somewhat awkward about it; it felt a bit
like we were getting rewarded for squealing.

___________________________________________________________
Copy addresses and emails from any email account to Yahoo! Mail - quick,
easy and free. http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/trueswitch2.html

vpFREE Links: http://members.cox.net/vpfree/Links.htm

Yahoo! Groups Links

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Curtis_Rich]

You make a very good point, KF. Now, that you mention this fact,
it makes the whole story sound fishy.

If the RF was still on the screen, when the winner "happily left"
after being paid, then one of two things happened:
1) he had just bet his final five credits before hitting the RF; or
2) he left with credits still on the machine.

Yes, either of these could have happened. But, it is unlikely.

BTW, I would definitely kept my mouth shut. It would be none
of my business. If you are sitting at a blackjack table and you
see the dealer paying someone who should have lost, do you
interrupt the dealer and point out his mistake? I don't think so.

···

On 8/9/06, King Fish <vpkingfish@gmail.com> wrote:

If they hadn't reset the jackpot, then whatever credits the real winner
had
when he hit the jackpot were still there.

After they reset the jackpot, did they cash out the remaining credits? Do
you know what happened to them?

Just curious.

On 8/8/06, Karen Beno <karen_beno@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>
> Last year my friend and I were playing VP at our home
> casino when a guy sitting behind us won a large
> jackpot on another VP machine. He was paid and happily
> left.
>
> A little while later, someone else sat down at this
> machine. He did not play. Apparently, the casino
> employee who paid the jackpot winner, had forgotten to
> register the win on the machine as "paid". Therefore
> it looked like the guy who was now sitting at the
> machine had won this jackpot and was waiting for his
> pay.
>
> Sure enough after a couple of minutes an employee came
> by, congratulated the "winner" and went off to get the
> money. Soon he came back with more employees in tow
> because somehow the "win" wasn't registering in their
> computer. After a while five or six different
> employees were standing around the "winner", including
> a supervisor. When it became clear that they were
> ready to pay the "winner" because they couldn't find
> out what was wrong, my friend and I had to decide what
> to do.
>
> We did not know the "winner". We did know all of the
> casino employees who all had been working there for
> years. The employee who paid the real winner, was one
> of the nicest people working in the casino. He often
> took care of us with free drinks (in this casino
> normally only high rollers, which we are not, get free
> drinks). He was likely to get part of the blame for
> the mistake of not registering the pay if they found
> out later what went wrong.
>
> On the other hand, if the guy who was trying to hustle
> the casino realized who tipped off the employees, he
> and his friends might not take too kindly towards us.
> We didn't want our heads bashed in when we left later
> that night! Plus it seemed the "winner" had not
> deliberately set out to get the money that didn't
> belong to him; had possibly not even noticed where he
> sat down. He just didn't say "no" when someone walked
> by, saw the win and offered to get him cash! And on
> the third hand, we weren't without sin ourselves
> having profited years ago from a computer malfunction
> regarding points which lasted for months (and after
> they fixed it, the same malfunction happened again a
> year later and lasted AGAIN for months - it was a
> mistake that benefit many if not all patrons and
> nobody ever got called on it afterwards as far as we
> know).
>
> My friend and I weren't sure we were the only ones who
> realized what was going on, but no-one else
> intervened. Finally we made a decision. My friend
> stealthily tugged the sleeve of one of the employees
> we knew and whispered that this jackpot had already
> been paid to someone else. The employee immediately
> left with the supervisor. They went back to the
> computer, talked briefly and came back to question the
> "winner" in a far less friendly tone than they had
> before. Before long they asked the guy to accompany
> them to a backroom and that was the end of it.
>
> Later that evening we were given an unlimited comp
> voucher for dinner and drinks in the restaurant
> (again, something quite extra-ordinary as this casino
> doesn't give out food or beverages as comps except to
> high rollers). While we were happy to receive the comp
> and did accept it (free food is free food after all)
> we did feel somewhat awkward about it; it felt a bit
> like we were getting rewarded for squealing.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Bill_Coleman1]

The difference is that this wasn't a "mistake", it was an attempt by
the guy who KNEW he hadn't hit the jackpot to steal from the casino.
The blackjack player overpaid might not even know it was a mistake.
Keeping your mouth shut would be morally and ethically wrong.

···

At 07:04 PM 8/9/2006, you wrote:

You make a very good point, KF. Now, that you mention this fact,
it makes the whole story sound fishy.

If the RF was still on the screen, when the winner "happily left"
after being paid, then one of two things happened:
1) he had just bet his final five credits before hitting the RF; or
2) he left with credits still on the machine.

Yes, either of these could have happened. But, it is unlikely.

BTW, I would definitely kept my mouth shut. It would be none
of my business. If you are sitting at a blackjack table and you
see the dealer paying someone who should have lost, do you
interrupt the dealer and point out his mistake? I don't think so.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Myra_Andrews]

I agree with you on this one. If a blackjack player is paid
erroneously for one hand- its only $10 or maybe $50 so I would not
say anything. It is small potatoes. This fellow trying to claim a
jackpot hadn't even bet anything-he was trying to scam them.

My husband, a novice poker player, played low-stakes Omaha poker at
the CalNeva in Reno. He thought he had a straight so he had one that
game. One of the regular players called "Mama" (an 80 year old
Chinese woman) told the dealer "yeah, he's got a straight". The
dealer proceeded to pay my husband.

Just as my husband was reaching for the money one of the players said
"I'm sorry but I just don't see a straight". Well my husband had
messed up-you are supposed to use 2 cards from the middle and 3 from
your hand (or possibly the other way around) to make up your 5-card
hand and he had it backwards. He did not have a straight. He was
so embarrassed he cashed out right after that and has never played
the game since.

Myra

···

On 9-Aug-06, at 8:11 PM, Bill Coleman wrote:

The difference is that this wasn't a "mistake", it was an attempt by
the guy who KNEW he hadn't hit the jackpot to steal from the casino.
The blackjack player overpaid might not even know it was a mistake.
Keeping your mouth shut would be morally and ethically wrong.

At 07:04 PM 8/9/2006, you wrote:
>You make a very good point, KF. Now, that you mention this fact,
>it makes the whole story sound fishy.
>
>If the RF was still on the screen, when the winner "happily left"
>after being paid, then one of two things happened:
>1) he had just bet his final five credits before hitting the RF; or
>2) he left with credits still on the machine.
>
>Yes, either of these could have happened. But, it is unlikely.
>
>BTW, I would definitely kept my mouth shut. It would be none
>of my business. If you are sitting at a blackjack table and you
>see the dealer paying someone who should have lost, do you
>interrupt the dealer and point out his mistake? I don't think so.
>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Myra_Andrews]

Oops, the word "won' is spelled WON not ONE.

···

On 9-Aug-06, at 8:40 PM, Myra Andrews wrote:

I agree with you on this one. If a blackjack player is paid
erroneously for one hand- its only $10 or maybe $50 so I would not
say anything. It is small potatoes. This fellow trying to claim a
jackpot hadn't even bet anything-he was trying to scam them.

My husband, a novice poker player, played low-stakes Omaha poker at
the CalNeva in Reno. He thought he had a straight so he had WON that
game. One of the regular players called "Mama" (an 80 year old
Chinese woman) told the dealer "yeah, he's got a straight". The
dealer proceeded to pay my husband.

Just as my husband was reaching for the money one of the players said
"I'm sorry but I just don't see a straight". Well my husband had
messed up-you are supposed to use 2 cards from the middle and 3 from
your hand (or possibly the other way around) to make up your 5-card
hand and he had it backwards. He did not have a straight. He was
so embarrassed he cashed out right after that and has never played
the game since.

Myra

On 9-Aug-06, at 8:11 PM, Bill Coleman wrote:

> The difference is that this wasn't a "mistake", it was an attempt by
> the guy who KNEW he hadn't hit the jackpot to steal from the casino.
> The blackjack player overpaid might not even know it was a mistake.
> Keeping your mouth shut would be morally and ethically wrong.
>
> At 07:04 PM 8/9/2006, you wrote:
> >You make a very good point, KF. Now, that you mention this fact,
> >it makes the whole story sound fishy.
> >
> >If the RF was still on the screen, when the winner "happily left"
> >after being paid, then one of two things happened:
> >1) he had just bet his final five credits before hitting the RF; or
> >2) he left with credits still on the machine.
> >
> >Yes, either of these could have happened. But, it is unlikely.
> >
> >BTW, I would definitely kept my mouth shut. It would be none
> >of my business. If you are sitting at a blackjack table and you
> >see the dealer paying someone who should have lost, do you
> >interrupt the dealer and point out his mistake? I don't think so.
> >
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Albert_Pearson]

I agree, there is a big difference between the house making a mistake completely on their own,
and somebody actively lying in order to gain a profit.

In fact here is a humorous little story that happened last year in Vegas.
Playing at a nice friendly BJ table at the Hilton, the dealer goes to pay off a player who had lost,
it was a small bet by a novice player and he told the dealer that she was wrong. Being a friendly dealer
but an honest one, she took back the payoff, gave the player a look of "poor rookie don't know shit",
and asked the rest of us players to straighten out the rookie for future transactions.
I told him to keep his mouth shut and give the dealer a nice tip on the next hand. Everyone agreed.

Regards
A.P.

···

----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Coleman" <vphobby2@cox.net>
To: <vpFREE@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, August 09, 2006 11:11 PM
Subject: Re: [vpFREE] What would you have done?

The difference is that this wasn't a "mistake", it was an attempt by
the guy who KNEW he hadn't hit the jackpot to steal from the casino.
The blackjack player overpaid might not even know it was a mistake.
Keeping your mouth shut would be morally and ethically wrong.

[Curtis_Rich]

There is no difference. In both situations, the casino made a
mistake. And, mistakes happen all of the time - for large
amounts and small.

In the case of the guy's attempt to claim a jackpot that he did
not win - well, it is a mistake for a casino to pay off *any*
jackpot twice.

Whether the player knows he's getting paid erroneously or
not is irrelevant. Either way, the casino is making a mistake.

Keeping my mouth shut is not morally or ethically wrong.
Especially, if they make the mistake in MY favor!!

···

On 8/9/06, Bill Coleman <vphobby2@cox.net> wrote:

The difference is that this wasn't a "mistake", it was an attempt by
the guy who KNEW he hadn't hit the jackpot to steal from the casino.
The blackjack player overpaid might not even know it was a mistake.
Keeping your mouth shut would be morally and ethically wrong.

At 07:04 PM 8/9/2006, you wrote:
>You make a very good point, KF. Now, that you mention this fact,
>it makes the whole story sound fishy.
>
>If the RF was still on the screen, when the winner "happily left"
>after being paid, then one of two things happened:
>1) he had just bet his final five credits before hitting the RF; or
>2) he left with credits still on the machine.
>
>Yes, either of these could have happened. But, it is unlikely.
>
>BTW, I would definitely kept my mouth shut. It would be none
>of my business. If you are sitting at a blackjack table and you
>see the dealer paying someone who should have lost, do you
>interrupt the dealer and point out his mistake? I don't think so.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Bill_Coleman1]

Theft is theft. It is not ambiguous. If the Brinks driver makes a
mistake and drops a bag of money outside the bank I suppose you would
feel justified in taking it. If the store owner forgets to lock up
and you find the door open I suppose you can go in and take what you wish.

I do truly pity you and anyone who might cross your path.

···

At 11:26 AM 8/10/2006, you wrote:

There is no difference. In both situations, the casino made a
mistake. And, mistakes happen all of the time - for large
amounts and small.

In the case of the guy's attempt to claim a jackpot that he did
not win - well, it is a mistake for a casino to pay off *any*
jackpot twice.

Whether the player knows he's getting paid erroneously or
not is irrelevant. Either way, the casino is making a mistake.

Keeping my mouth shut is not morally or ethically wrong.
Especially, if they make the mistake in MY favor!!

On 8/9/06, Bill Coleman <vphobby2@cox.net> wrote:
>
> The difference is that this wasn't a "mistake", it was an attempt by
> the guy who KNEW he hadn't hit the jackpot to steal from the casino.
> The blackjack player overpaid might not even know it was a mistake.
> Keeping your mouth shut would be morally and ethically wrong.
>
>
> At 07:04 PM 8/9/2006, you wrote:
> >You make a very good point, KF. Now, that you mention this fact,
> >it makes the whole story sound fishy.
> >
> >If the RF was still on the screen, when the winner "happily left"
> >after being paid, then one of two things happened:
> >1) he had just bet his final five credits before hitting the RF; or
> >2) he left with credits still on the machine.
> >
> >Yes, either of these could have happened. But, it is unlikely.
> >
> >BTW, I would definitely kept my mouth shut. It would be none
> >of my business. If you are sitting at a blackjack table and you
> >see the dealer paying someone who should have lost, do you
> >interrupt the dealer and point out his mistake? I don't think so.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

vpFREE Links: http://members.cox.net/vpfree/Links.htm

Yahoo! Groups Links

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Curtis_Rich]

I still think that the original story sounds fishy. If it really did
happen, we're obviously not getting the whole story. But,
something good has come out of this! We're having a great
discussion! It's a hell of a lot more interesting than any
mathematical equation or what the progressives were at
1:23pm this afternoon.

Thanks, but I don't need any pity. I will make this a little clearer.

If I am sitting at a blackjack table and I see the dealer is paying
someone who should have lost, I will not interrupt the dealer and
point out his mistake. If I am walking down the street and I find
a bag of money (regardless of how it got there), I will take it.
I will not take anything from a store without paying for it,
regardless if the store is open, closed, locked, or unlocked.

Hey, I'm not saying that the guy should have tried to steal the
VP jackpot.

I'm not saying that I would try to steal a jackpot that was already
paid to someone else.

What I AM saying is:
If a casino makes a mistake in my favor, I will keep my mouth
shut and take the extra money. If I see someone else getting
paid when they shouldn't, I will keep my mouth shut. If I see
an old lady getting mugged, I will do everything I can to stop it.

···

On 8/10/06, Bill Coleman <vphobby2@cox.net> wrote:

Theft is theft. It is not ambiguous. If the Brinks driver makes a
mistake and drops a bag of money outside the bank I suppose you would
feel justified in taking it. If the store owner forgets to lock up
and you find the door open I suppose you can go in and take what you wish.

I do truly pity you and anyone who might cross your path.

At 11:26 AM 8/10/2006, you wrote:
>There is no difference. In both situations, the casino made a
>mistake. And, mistakes happen all of the time - for large
>amounts and small.
>
>In the case of the guy's attempt to claim a jackpot that he did
>not win - well, it is a mistake for a casino to pay off *any*
>jackpot twice.
>
>Whether the player knows he's getting paid erroneously or
>not is irrelevant. Either way, the casino is making a mistake.
>
>Keeping my mouth shut is not morally or ethically wrong.
>Especially, if they make the mistake in MY favor!!
>
>
>On 8/9/06, Bill Coleman < vphobby2@cox.net> wrote:
> >
> > The difference is that this wasn't a "mistake", it was an attempt by
> > the guy who KNEW he hadn't hit the jackpot to steal from the casino.
> > The blackjack player overpaid might not even know it was a mistake.
> > Keeping your mouth shut would be morally and ethically wrong.
> >
> >
> > At 07:04 PM 8/9/2006, you wrote:
> > >You make a very good point, KF. Now, that you mention this fact,
> > >it makes the whole story sound fishy.
> > >
> > >If the RF was still on the screen, when the winner "happily left"
> > >after being paid, then one of two things happened:
> > >1) he had just bet his final five credits before hitting the RF; or
> > >2) he left with credits still on the machine.
> > >
> > >Yes, either of these could have happened. But, it is unlikely.
> > >
> > >BTW, I would definitely kept my mouth shut. It would be none
> > >of my business. If you are sitting at a blackjack table and you
> > >see the dealer paying someone who should have lost, do you
> > >interrupt the dealer and point out his mistake? I don't think so.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[vex1]

Bill Coleman wrote:

If honest citizens do not report crimes they witness then we have no
civilization. This wasn't some grey area, it was theft. Probably a
felony. Would you have committed the same crime? Or failed to report
it if you saw it?

And, by the way, reporting a crime you witness (even if you report it
while it is going on) is not squealing in my book. It is what you are
SUPPOSED to do.

I totally agree. BUT...

Don't most casinos have some sort of disclaimer that says, "We reserve the
right to refuse payment of jackpots due to machine malfunction", or
something like that? If this was the case, (In a way, it was... The
machine was not reset, and they had no record of the win), shouldn't they
have erred on the side of caution and said, "Sorry, your play here was
invalid because we can't validate your win"?

The would-be thief probably would have left, without much fanfare.

--Brett

···

---------------------------------------------------
"Life should not be a journey to the grave with the intention of
arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid
broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and proclaiming,
'Wow-What a Ride!' "