Question for the VP gurus here.
What is the effect on the game when the discards from the deal are returned to the deck for the draw?
Thanks in advance!
Have a happy holidays 
What is the effect when discarded are returned to the deck for the draw?
Before an answer is posted, is this a “hypothetical” question or does it reflect a game actually on the casino floor?
Technically, vp card manipulation must stay true to the standard handling of a physical card deck in play, unless otherwise detailed explicitly (as in “Dreamcard vp”). In other words, a player wouldn’t normally expect a discard to be returned to the deck for availability on the draw and you shouldn’t expect to see a machine with this “feature” without explicit disclosure.
That said, there’s little doubt the “feature” would have an adverse impact on EV; a card is discarded only when keeping it impairs the value of the held cards (or has less value than discarding the full hand).
—In vpF…@…com, <mvetanen@…> wrote :
Question for the VP gurus here.
What is the effect on the game when the discards from the deal are returned to the deck for the draw?
Thanks in advance!
Have a happy holidays
mvetanen asks: “What is the effect on the game when the discards from the deal are returned to the deck for the draw?”
This would be a “continuous shuffler” (CSM) without a discard buffer.
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I believe that the game is EXACTLY PLAYED as the HELP screen says it is. To make any assumptions about the game, as in how it may work or one thinks it should work, can be a mistake in my opinion. If the help is silent about a feature of the game, then that feature is not part of the game!
It is my understanding that the games play out specifically and exactly as how the help screens say it is. I have asked Slot techs and Slot managers this question, who also looked at help screens and they said the machine function with the features as how the help says. "If the feature I am looking for is not in the help, it is then not in the game."
Here is a link to two help screen shots, from different machines though from the same company.
http://imgur.com/a/FgJaJ
A casino manager once told me, when I ran in to a CLASS 2 Video Poker machine and complained it was deceptive, that: "It is the players responsibility to evaluate the game, read the help screens, and then decide if they will pay it or not."
As a player, we can assume NOTHING these days.
Some less than honest internet casinos do this. Costs about 5% on most VP games.
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On Tuesday, December 20, 2016 2:18 PM, “mveta…@…com [vpFREE]” <vpF…@…com> wrote:
I believe that the game is EXACTLY PLAYED as the HELP screen says it is. To make any assumptions about the game, as in how it may work or one thinks it should work, can be a mistake in my opinion. If the help is silent about a feature of the game, then that feature is not part of the game!
It is my understanding that the games play out specifically and exactly as how the help screens say it is. I have asked Slot techs and Slot managers this question, who also looked at help screens and they said the machine function with the features as how the help says. “If the feature I am looking for is not in the help, it is then not in the game.”
Here is a link to two help screen shots, from different machines though from the same company.
A casino manager once told me, when I ran in to a CLASS 2 Video Poker machine and complained it was deceptive, that: “It is the players responsibility to evaluate the game, read the help screens, and then decide if they will pay it or not.”
As a player, we can assume NOTHING these days.
Howard Stern: "Some less than honest internet casinos do this. Costs about 5% on most VP games."
So, a 9/6 JOB setup to put the discards back in the deck, reshuffle then replace the discards from the draw, would have return rate of 94.5%
Thanks! This is exactly what information I was looking for.