vpFREE2 Forums

VP Puzzle - Explain this credit discrepancy

#1

The only thing I can think of is that right before you hit the royal you put
in a $30 ticket and pressed deal before the credits got added...there is a
window of a couple seconds during which you can do that. In that case they
show up after the hand is complete.

Cogno

···

-----Original Message-----
From: vpFREE@yahoogroups.com [mailto:vpF…@…com] On Behalf
Of caribou321
Sent: Monday, August 16, 2010 9:01 PM
To: vpFREE@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [vpFREE] VP Puzzle - Explain this credit discrepancy

Someone pointed out to me something very strange.

I took a picture of a recent royal flush before and after I was paid.
Take a look at the total amount (besides the royal). It increases from
190 to 220.

There is no mistake here, these two pictures are of the same machine
and of the same royal. And no, I did not add any credits to the
machine. I am positive of that (and why would I anyway?).

Before handpay
http://i35.tinypic.com/nwhfg7.jpg

After handpay before playing it off
http://i37.tinypic.com/wt6peb.jpg

------------------------------------

vpFREE Links: http://members.cox.net/vpfree/Links.htm

Yahoo! Groups Links

#2

I am 100% sure that was not the case. I thought I made that clear in my original post that there was no chance I added cash/tickets to add credits to the machines.

To the other responses: I didn't "make waves". Was just asking how anyone thinks this could happen. And no, had I noticed, I wouldn't have pointed it out to anyone there of course. The only reason I noticed was someone else pointed it out after seeing the photos.

···

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Cogno Scienti" <cognoscienti@...> wrote:

The only thing I can think of is that right before you hit the royal you put
in a $30 ticket and pressed deal before the credits got added...there is a
window of a couple seconds during which you can do that. In that case they
show up after the hand is complete.

Cogno

#3

Here's my take if anyone cares on what the only two possible answers are:

1- The attendant keyed in the remaining credits after the handpay incorrectly (or)

2-You put in $30 cash/ticket before taking the next picture.

In the case of possibility #2, I have a question...how was the last $100 of the $4k jackpot paid to you? I know the attendants break it down to smaller increments so that you'll tip them. How much did you tip? $20, $40, $50, maybe $70. How much was left over from the tip? $30? Maybe $50, 2 twenties and a ten. Maybe you gave your friend/spouse a $20 and threw the other change in the machine before snapping the picture. Just figuring the possibilities here. Sometimes we forget or not notice inconsequential details when an exciting event occurs.

···

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "caribou321" <caribou321@...> wrote:

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Cogno Scienti" <cognoscienti@> wrote:
>
> The only thing I can think of is that right before you hit the royal you put
> in a $30 ticket and pressed deal before the credits got added...there is a
> window of a couple seconds during which you can do that. In that case they
> show up after the hand is complete.
>
> Cogno
>

I am 100% sure that was not the case. I thought I made that clear in my original post that there was no chance I added cash/tickets to add credits to the machines.

To the other responses: I didn't "make waves". Was just asking how anyone thinks this could happen. And no, had I noticed, I wouldn't have pointed it out to anyone there of course. The only reason I noticed was someone else pointed it out after seeing the photos.

#4

Does the casino in question have one of those random lucky seat jackpot/drawing sort of things?

#5

No

···

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, Lone Locust of the Apocalypse <zorak@...> wrote:

Does the casino in question have one of those random lucky seat
jackpot/drawing sort of things?

#6

Here's my take if anyone cares on what the only two possible answers are:

1- The attendant keyed in the remaining credits after the handpay incorrectly (or)

2-You put in $30 cash/ticket before taking the next picture.

In the case of possibility #2, I have a question...how was the last $100 of the $4k jackpot paid to you? I know the attendants break it down to smaller increments so that you'll tip them. How much did you tip? $20, $40, $50, maybe $70. How much was left over from the tip? $30? Maybe $50, 2 twenties and a ten. Maybe you gave your friend/spouse a $20 and threw the other change in the machine before snapping the picture. Just figuring the possibilities here. Sometimes we forget or not notice inconsequential details when an exciting event occurs.

Can I ask HOW you even ask about possibility #2 when I have stated at least twice here, INCLUDING in the very post you quoted, that I DID NOT insert any funds into the machine near the time of the royal??? Let me spell it out, that includes inserting cash, tickets, or any other form of funds or bonuses. None. Repeat NONE!

""I know the attendants break it down to smaller increments so that you'll tip them. ""

What you "know" did not happen, I was paid in all 100's, 40 of them.

How much did I tip? That's personal, and it came out of my wallet. I did not tip $100. No, no one else handed or gave me money for the tip or change or coupons etc. Just me and the attendant at the payout.

If you look I already posted my conclusion which was based on someone else's similar experience, and backed up with my observations of the attendant taking out a cheat sheet while entering codes. Isn't that enough to make that the logical explanation?

Let me repeat again, I did NOT add cash to the machine. In fact, I played on the remaining credits the rest of the evening.

Still I am curious how you bring up item 2, when I spelled out that it didn't happen. Please email me, I would like to understand what was not clear about my other posts.

···

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Jim" <deucesdamule@...> wrote:

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "caribou321" <caribou321@> wrote:
>
>
>
> --- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Cogno Scienti" <cognoscienti@> wrote:
> >
> > The only thing I can think of is that right before you hit the royal you put
> > in a $30 ticket and pressed deal before the credits got added...there is a
> > window of a couple seconds during which you can do that. In that case they
> > show up after the hand is complete.
> >
> > Cogno
> >
>
> I am 100% sure that was not the case. I thought I made that clear in my original post that there was no chance I added cash/tickets to add credits to the machines.
>
> To the other responses: I didn't "make waves". Was just asking how anyone thinks this could happen. And no, had I noticed, I wouldn't have pointed it out to anyone there of course. The only reason I noticed was someone else pointed it out after seeing the photos.
>

#7

I'd be very surprised if the attendant could add credits by pressing keys on
the bonusing system keypad. The only thing they should be able to do is turn
the key, which removes the jackpot credits. It would be a huge security risk
if attendants could add credits.

Anyway, I've never seen a machine like that. There's a blue $1 inside a
yellow circle. And the "more games" and "draw" buttons are displayed during
the jackpot. Looking through the vpFREE photo gallery I don't see any
machines that display anything but "See Pays" when locked up, nor do I see
any blue denomination indicators.

So assuming the photo hasn't been altered, I'm very curious what kind of
machine this is. It looks like an IGT Game King other than that. Possibly
it's been altered and has a secondary program that's buggy.

Cogno

···

-----Original Message-----
From: vpFREE@yahoogroups.com [mailto:vpF…@…com] On Behalf Of
caribou321
Sent: Wednesday, August 18, 2010 8:15 AM
To: vpFREE@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [vpFREE] Re: VP Puzzle - Explain this credit discrepancy

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Jim" <deucesdamule@...> wrote:

Here's my take if anyone cares on what the only two possible answers are:

1- The attendant keyed in the remaining credits after the handpay

incorrectly (or)

2-You put in $30 cash/ticket before taking the next picture.

In the case of possibility #2, I have a question...how was the last $100

of the $4k jackpot paid to you? I know the attendants break it down to
smaller increments so that you'll tip them. How much did you tip? $20, $40,
$50, maybe $70. How much was left over from the tip? $30? Maybe $50, 2
twenties and a ten. Maybe you gave your friend/spouse a $20 and threw the
other change in the machine before snapping the picture. Just figuring the
possibilities here. Sometimes we forget or not notice inconsequential
details when an exciting event occurs.

Can I ask HOW you even ask about possibility #2 when I have stated at least
twice here, INCLUDING in the very post you quoted, that I DID NOT insert any
funds into the machine near the time of the royal??? Let me spell it out,
that includes inserting cash, tickets, or any other form of funds or
bonuses. None. Repeat NONE!

""I know the attendants break it down to smaller increments so that you'll
tip them. ""

What you "know" did not happen, I was paid in all 100's, 40 of them.

How much did I tip? That's personal, and it came out of my wallet. I did
not tip $100. No, no one else handed or gave me money for the tip or change
or coupons etc. Just me and the attendant at the payout.

If you look I already posted my conclusion which was based on someone else's
similar experience, and backed up with my observations of the attendant
taking out a cheat sheet while entering codes. Isn't that enough to make
that the logical explanation?

Let me repeat again, I did NOT add cash to the machine. In fact, I played on
the remaining credits the rest of the evening.

Still I am curious how you bring up item 2, when I spelled out that it
didn't happen. Please email me, I would like to understand what was not
clear about my other posts.

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "caribou321" <caribou321@> wrote:
>
>
>
> --- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Cogno Scienti" <cognoscienti@> wrote:
> >
> > The only thing I can think of is that right before you hit the royal

you put

> > in a $30 ticket and pressed deal before the credits got added...there

is a

> > window of a couple seconds during which you can do that. In that case

they

> > show up after the hand is complete.
> >
> > Cogno
> >
>
> I am 100% sure that was not the case. I thought I made that clear in my

original post that there was no chance I added cash/tickets to add credits
to the machines.

>
> To the other responses: I didn't "make waves". Was just asking how

anyone thinks this could happen. And no, had I noticed, I wouldn't have
pointed it out to anyone there of course. The only reason I noticed was
someone else pointed it out after seeing the photos.

>

------------------------------------

vpFREE Links: http://members.cox.net/vpfree/Links.htm

Yahoo! Groups Links

#8

AH-HA!
I think that you're on to something here. I ALSO looked at one of my recent jackpots (lockup) and I agree, it "greys" out all the buttons, EXCEPT "see pays"
Also, if you notice in the "before" picture, even though she has drawn the royal, the button still says "DRAW". So, it's definitely something within the software of the machine, that caused it to ALSO pay that Royal Flush, as a regular flush (accounting for the "extra" $30)
Weird..but also weird software on it; I agree, doesn't look like typical GameKing stuff...

···

the "more games" and "draw" buttons are displayed during
the jackpot. Looking through the vpFREE photo gallery I don't see any
machines that display anything but "See Pays" when locked up, nor do I see
any blue denomination indicators.

So assuming the photo hasn't been altered, I'm very curious what kind of
machine this is. It looks like an IGT Game King other than that. Possibly
it's been altered and has a secondary program that's buggy.

#9

Gee, you're wound up little friggin' tight. Why even post here if you're not looking to stir up intriguing thought. I read your posts and runderstood what you wrote clearly. First of all, I didn't "ask" about anything. Second, I'm still free to post my opinions here. I did not say you were mistaken, just threw out some possibilities.

Wow, since when is tipping so incredibly personal. The whole population of the casino can stand there and watch your jackpot paid out to you and observe how much you tip.

One last observation from this reply though: obviously the slot attendant didn't know what he was doing being that he paid out the $4k in hundreds risking the possibility of no tip. This does further reiterates that the attendant probably did type in the wrong credit amount during the re-start on the machine.

And really, take a chill pill.

···

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "caribou321" <caribou321@...> wrote:

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Jim" <deucesdamule@> wrote:
>
> Here's my take if anyone cares on what the only two possible answers are:
>
> 1- The attendant keyed in the remaining credits after the handpay incorrectly (or)
>
> 2-You put in $30 cash/ticket before taking the next picture.
>
> In the case of possibility #2, I have a question...how was the last $100 of the $4k jackpot paid to you? I know the attendants break it down to smaller increments so that you'll tip them. How much did you tip? $20, $40, $50, maybe $70. How much was left over from the tip? $30? Maybe $50, 2 twenties and a ten. Maybe you gave your friend/spouse a $20 and threw the other change in the machine before snapping the picture. Just figuring the possibilities here. Sometimes we forget or not notice inconsequential details when an exciting event occurs.
>

Can I ask HOW you even ask about possibility #2 when I have stated at least twice here, INCLUDING in the very post you quoted, that I DID NOT insert any funds into the machine near the time of the royal??? Let me spell it out, that includes inserting cash, tickets, or any other form of funds or bonuses. None. Repeat NONE!

""I know the attendants break it down to smaller increments so that you'll tip them. ""

What you "know" did not happen, I was paid in all 100's, 40 of them.

How much did I tip? That's personal, and it came out of my wallet. I did not tip $100. No, no one else handed or gave me money for the tip or change or coupons etc. Just me and the attendant at the payout.

If you look I already posted my conclusion which was based on someone else's similar experience, and backed up with my observations of the attendant taking out a cheat sheet while entering codes. Isn't that enough to make that the logical explanation?

Let me repeat again, I did NOT add cash to the machine. In fact, I played on the remaining credits the rest of the evening.

Still I am curious how you bring up item 2, when I spelled out that it didn't happen. Please email me, I would like to understand what was not clear about my other posts.

> --- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "caribou321" <caribou321@> wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> > --- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Cogno Scienti" <cognoscienti@> wrote:
> > >
> > > The only thing I can think of is that right before you hit the royal you put
> > > in a $30 ticket and pressed deal before the credits got added...there is a
> > > window of a couple seconds during which you can do that. In that case they
> > > show up after the hand is complete.
> > >
> > > Cogno
> > >
> >
> > I am 100% sure that was not the case. I thought I made that clear in my original post that there was no chance I added cash/tickets to add credits to the machines.
> >
> > To the other responses: I didn't "make waves". Was just asking how anyone thinks this could happen. And no, had I noticed, I wouldn't have pointed it out to anyone there of course. The only reason I noticed was someone else pointed it out after seeing the photos.
> >
>

#10

To quote a great American icon, who is symbolic of what this country has become,
"Why can't we all just get along?"

LOL

···

________________________________
From: Jim <deucesdamule@yahoo.com>
To: vpFREE@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wed, August 18, 2010 5:52:43 PM
Subject: [vpFREE] Re: VP Puzzle - Explain this credit discrepancy

Gee, you're wound up little friggin' tight. Why even post here if you're not
looking to stir up intriguing thought. I read your posts and runderstood what
you wrote clearly. First of all, I didn't "ask" about anything. Second, I'm
still free to post my opinions here. I did not say you were mistaken, just threw
out some possibilities.

Wow, since when is tipping so incredibly personal. The whole population of the
casino can stand there and watch your jackpot paid out to you and observe how
much you tip.

One last observation from this reply though: obviously the slot attendant didn't
know what he was doing being that he paid out the $4k in hundreds risking the
possibility of no tip. This does further reiterates that the attendant probably
did type in the wrong credit amount during the re-start on the machine.

And really, take a chill pill.

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "caribou321" <caribou321@...> wrote:

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Jim" <deucesdamule@> wrote:
>
> Here's my take if anyone cares on what the only two possible answers are:
>
> 1- The attendant keyed in the remaining credits after the handpay incorrectly
(or)
>
> 2-You put in $30 cash/ticket before taking the next picture.
>
> In the case of possibility #2, I have a question...how was the last $100 of
the $4k jackpot paid to you? I know the attendants break it down to smaller
increments so that you'll tip them. How much did you tip? $20, $40, $50, maybe
$70. How much was left over from the tip? $30? Maybe $50, 2 twenties and a ten.
Maybe you gave your friend/spouse a $20 and threw the other change in the
machine before snapping the picture. Just figuring the possibilities here.
Sometimes we forget or not notice inconsequential details when an exciting event
occurs.
>

Can I ask HOW you even ask about possibility #2 when I have stated at least
twice here, INCLUDING in the very post you quoted, that I DID NOT insert any
funds into the machine near the time of the royal??? Let me spell it out, that
includes inserting cash, tickets, or any other form of funds or bonuses. None.
Repeat NONE!

""I know the attendants break it down to smaller increments so that you'll tip
them. ""

What you "know" did not happen, I was paid in all 100's, 40 of them.

How much did I tip? That's personal, and it came out of my wallet. I did not
tip $100. No, no one else handed or gave me money for the tip or change or
coupons etc. Just me and the attendant at the payout.

If you look I already posted my conclusion which was based on someone else's
similar experience, and backed up with my observations of the attendant taking
out a cheat sheet while entering codes. Isn't that enough to make that the
logical explanation?

Let me repeat again, I did NOT add cash to the machine. In fact, I played on
the remaining credits the rest of the evening.

Still I am curious how you bring up item 2, when I spelled out that it didn't
happen. Please email me, I would like to understand what was not clear about my
other posts.

> --- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "caribou321" <caribou321@> wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> > --- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Cogno Scienti" <cognoscienti@> wrote:
> > >
> > > The only thing I can think of is that right before you hit the royal you
put
> > > in a $30 ticket and pressed deal before the credits got added...there is
a
> > > window of a couple seconds during which you can do that. In that case
they
> > > show up after the hand is complete.
> > >
> > > Cogno
> > >
> >
> > I am 100% sure that was not the case. I thought I made that clear in my
original post that there was no chance I added cash/tickets to add credits to
the machines.
> >
> > To the other responses: I didn't "make waves". Was just asking how anyone
thinks this could happen. And no, had I noticed, I wouldn't have pointed it out
to anyone there of course. The only reason I noticed was someone else pointed
it out after seeing the photos.
> >
>

------------------------------------

vpFREE Links: http://members.cox.net/vpfree/Links.htm

Yahoo! Groups Links

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

#11

when a slot attendant brings forty large on a $1 royal, without breaking the last hundred down, some people are actually *more* inclined to tip. i think it's a sign of respect for the player.

but by breaking it down, the slot attendant is suggesting that a minimum $20 tip is customary... and there are many players who simply do not care for being told what to do. i'm one of them.

if i don't have any small bills on me, i'll tell the attendant to break down the last hundred. but for the attendant - or the main cage - to do it on their own... that's awfully presumptuous.

so perhaps the slot attendant knew exactly what he was doing.

···

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Jim" <deucesdamule@...> wrote:

...obviously the slot attendant didn't know what he was doing being that he paid out the $4k in hundreds risking the possibility of no tip.

#12

If a slot attendant brought me 40 large on a $1 royal I'd tip more than $100 because they're going to need a new job soon.

···

On Thu, 19 Aug 2010, ukstages wrote:

when a slot attendant brings forty large on a $1 royal, without breaking the last hundred down, some people are actually *more* inclined to tip. i think it's a sign of respect for the player.

#13

Cogno Scienti wrote:

I'd be very surprised if the attendant could add credits by
pressing keys on the bonusing system keypad. The only thing they
should be able to do is turn the key, which removes the jackpot
credits. It would be a huge security risk if attendants could add
credits.

I strongly agree. I believe the entry by the attendant when keying the jackpot (while looking at a "cheat sheet") involves a manual reconfirmation of the specific winning hand cards. I've sporadically seen this done at various casinos.

Anyway, I've never seen a machine like that. There's a blue $1
inside a yellow circle. And the "more games" and "draw" buttons are
displayed during the jackpot. Looking through the vpFREE photo
gallery I don't see any machines that display anything but "See
Pays" when locked up, nor do I see any blue denomination indicators.

So assuming the photo hasn't been altered, I'm very curious what
kind of machine this is. It looks like an IGT Game King other than
that. Possibly it's been altered and has a secondary program that's
buggy.

Borgata has this generation of IGT machines on the floor. While the "More Games" and "Draw" remain displayed, the buttons are dulled and not available for selection. The "See Pays / Help" button is bright and will respond to a press.

A possible "gaffe" isn't an issue here.

#14

I was told years ago by an independent host that the slot attendants were NOT
supposed to break down the last Franklin, and she was infuriated that one did it
to me. For a small (under $1.2K) handpay, I expect to get all large. If its
above that, where they have to get a W2G processed and get the cash from the
cage, I'll specify, "All large, please"

My personal habit, in the interests of balancing out the world karma, is to tip
$5 for under $1K, $10 above that, and $20 for a $1 RF. BUT if I've got to wait
an inordinate amount of time for an attendant to arrive, or if they break down
the last Franklin despite my request, I'm afraid world karma suffers a bit of a
jolt. One attendant actually had the cojones to question the lack of a tip,
after I waited 15 minutes for her to dawdle back with my $4K, AND she counted
out the Jackson 5 for the last hundred, after I specifically requested all
large. I suspect she was a bit more considerate after I politely pointed out the
errors of her ways.

Guru

Certainly the game is rigged. Don’t let that stop you; if you don’t bet, you
can’t win. -Lazarus Long

In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice. But, in practice,
there is. -Yogi Berra
There is no such thing as luck. There is only adequate or inadequate preparation
to cope with a statistical universe. -Robert Heinlein

when a slot attendant brings forty large on a $1 royal, without breaking the
last hundred down, some people are actually *more* inclined to tip. i think it's
a sign of respect for the player.

but by breaking it down, the slot attendant is suggesting that a minimum $20 tip
is customary... and there are many players who simply do not care for being told
what to do. i'm one of them.

if i don't have any small bills on me, i'll tell the attendant to break down the
last hundred. but for the attendant - or the main cage - to do it on their
own... that's awfully presumptuous.

so perhaps the slot attendant knew exactly what he was doing.

_,_._,___

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

#15

Just the opposite here, I appreciate having the last $100 broken down to include 20's and 10's so it's easier to tip.

What I don't care for is having it broke into only two $50's. Now THAT's presumptuous! :wink:

Mac
www.CasinoCamper.com

···

if i don't have any small bills on me, i'll tell the attendant to break down the
last hundred. but for the attendant - or the main cage - to do it on their
own... that's awfully presumptuous.

#16

When I got paid for the Royal last night, for some reason they broke down the last $200 into $20s. (Of course, times being what they are, they might easily have run short of $100s.)

Regardless, I gave the guy a $100 (only one person does handpays) as he's been a pretty friendly guy when he's done hopper fills and things like that in the past. (I almost hated to do it because I know they pool tips, but the other attendants have been pretty decednt to work with too.)

···

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "casino_camper" <mac_mcclellan@...> wrote:

Just the opposite here, I appreciate having the last $100 broken down to include 20's and 10's so it's easier to tip.

What I don't care for is having it broke into only two $50's. Now THAT's presumptuous! :wink:

Mac
www.CasinoCamper.com

> if i don't have any small bills on me, i'll tell the attendant to break down the
> last hundred. but for the attendant - or the main cage - to do it on their
> own... that's awfully presumptuous.

#17

A benjamin tip. wow. Hope it was at least a 20K royal

···

On Sun, Sep 12, 2010 at 6:17 PM, rwhannu <RWHANNU@aol.com> wrote:

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com <vpFREE%40yahoogroups.com>, "casino_camper"
<mac_mcclellan@...> wrote:
>
> Just the opposite here, I appreciate having the last $100 broken down to
include 20's and 10's so it's easier to tip.
>
> What I don't care for is having it broke into only two $50's. Now THAT's
presumptuous! :wink:
>
> Mac
> www.CasinoCamper.com <http://www.casinocamper.com/>
>
>
> > if i don't have any small bills on me, i'll tell the attendant to break
down the
> > last hundred. but for the attendant - or the main cage - to do it on
their
> > own... that's awfully presumptuous.
>

When I got paid for the Royal last night, for some reason they broke down
the last $200 into $20s. (Of course, times being what they are, they might
easily have run short of $100s.)

Regardless, I gave the guy a $100 (only one person does handpays) as he's
been a pretty friendly guy when he's done hopper fills and things like that
in the past. (I almost hated to do it because I know they pool tips, but the
other attendants have been pretty decednt to work with too.)

--
Jack

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