"gamb00ler" wrote:
For more detailed information on alternative strategies
(i.e. differing from the usual max EV strategy) search for
posts from Steve Jacobs.
The vpFREE FAQ contains this link to information about alternative
strategies courtesy of Steve Jacobs:
http://members.cox.net/vpfree/FAQ_S.htm
<a href="http://members.cox.net/vpfree/FAQ_S.htm">
http://members.cox.net/vpfree/FAQ_S.htm</a>
You are right, I am wrong. I never thought anyone would play these games. The sign is misleading though. THe small "up to" is ridiculous. Why don't they just say what the Royal is at, and say Progressive Quarter Royal now over $$$$$? OVER 103% return?
It is now obvious I was mistaken. People will play any paytable it seems for a chance at a big jackpot.
I never thought the quarter Royal would get over $4000.
I DID expect not everyone would play the highest meter.
Ploppers have their favorite games, and that is what they bare going to play, pay tables be damned.
I just hate to see people lose their bankroll, chasing the Royal. I don't think it is good for the overall M structure. Thinking of a casino as where I always lose, is not good for business.
Ploppers and the general public think that way. Losing quickly is not good for overall business. But maybe I am wrong there as well, and people was to win or lose fairly quickly.
I am amazed you played for 5 hours on $100. I just see people feeding money into the games. Obviously you know this game far better than the average folk and can maintain quite well over long periods of time.
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "vpFREE Administrator" <vpfreeadmin@...> wrote:
"gamb00ler" wrote:
> For more detailed information on alternative strategies
> (i.e. differing from the usual max EV strategy) search for
> posts from Steve Jacobs.The vpFREE FAQ contains this link to information about alternative
strategies courtesy of Steve Jacobs:http://members.cox.net/vpfree/FAQ_S.htm
<a href="http://members.cox.net/vpfree/FAQ_S.htm">
http://members.cox.net/vpfree/FAQ_S.htm</a>
I applaud your concern for others well being, it is a trait we share. And I'm very very glad you now understand where the M got their numbers for the sign.
Just one person getting it makes all my time on vpFREE seem worth it.
Very Good luck to you.
~FK
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "the7thwarrior" <Judy@...> wrote: You are right, I am wrong. I never thought anyone would play these games. The sign is misleading though. THe small "up to" is ridiculous. Why don't they just say what the Royal is at, and say Progressive Quarter Royal now over $$$$$? OVER 103% return?
It is now obvious I was mistaken. People will play any paytable it seems for a chance at a big jackpot.
I never thought the quarter Royal would get over $4000.
I DID expect not everyone would play the highest meter.
Ploppers have their favorite games, and that is what they bare going to play, pay tables be damned.
I just hate to see people lose their bankroll, chasing the Royal. I don't think it is good for the overall M structure. Thinking of a casino as where I always lose, is not good for business.
Ploppers and the general public think that way. Losing quickly is not good for overall business. But maybe I am wrong there as well, and people was to win or lose fairly quickly.I am amazed you played for 5 hours on $100. I just see people feeding money into the games. Obviously you know this game far better than the average folk and can maintain quite well over long periods of time.
What's the highest quarter progressive now?
In dollar amounts please not percent.
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Frank" <frank@...> wrote:
I applaud your concern for others well being, it is a trait we share. And I'm very very glad you now understand where the M got their numbers for the sign.
Just one person getting it makes all my time on vpFREE seem worth it.
Very Good luck to you.
~FK
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "the7thwarrior" <Judy@> wrote: You are right, I am wrong. I never thought anyone would play these games. The sign is misleading though. THe small "up to" is ridiculous. Why don't they just say what the Royal is at, and say Progressive Quarter Royal now over $$$$$? OVER 103% return?
>
> It is now obvious I was mistaken. People will play any paytable it seems for a chance at a big jackpot.
>
> I never thought the quarter Royal would get over $4000.
>
> I DID expect not everyone would play the highest meter.
>
> Ploppers have their favorite games, and that is what they bare going to play, pay tables be damned.
>
> I just hate to see people lose their bankroll, chasing the Royal. I don't think it is good for the overall M structure. Thinking of a casino as where I always lose, is not good for business.
> Ploppers and the general public think that way. Losing quickly is not good for overall business. But maybe I am wrong there as well, and people was to win or lose fairly quickly.
>
> I am amazed you played for 5 hours on $100. I just see people feeding money into the games. Obviously you know this game far better than the average folk and can maintain quite well over long periods of time.
3 Royals hit today that I'm aware of.
$2,300 Double Bonus
$4,300 Joker KoB
$4,100 Super Double Bonus
Leaving the highest meter at a sad pathetic $3,600. Yes that is sarcasm.
No, I don't remember the game I was very tired when I left.
~FK
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "chicken2692002" <melbedewy1226@...> wrote:
What's the highest quarter progressive now?
In dollar amounts please not percent.--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Frank" <frank@> wrote:
>
> I applaud your concern for others well being, it is a trait we share. And I'm very very glad you now understand where the M got their numbers for the sign.
>
> Just one person getting it makes all my time on vpFREE seem worth it.
>
> Very Good luck to you.
>
> ~FK
>
> --- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "the7thwarrior" <Judy@> wrote: You are right, I am wrong. I never thought anyone would play these games. The sign is misleading though. THe small "up to" is ridiculous. Why don't they just say what the Royal is at, and say Progressive Quarter Royal now over $$$$$? OVER 103% return?
> >
> > It is now obvious I was mistaken. People will play any paytable it seems for a chance at a big jackpot.
> >
> > I never thought the quarter Royal would get over $4000.
> >
> > I DID expect not everyone would play the highest meter.
> >
> > Ploppers have their favorite games, and that is what they bare going to play, pay tables be damned.
> >
> > I just hate to see people lose their bankroll, chasing the Royal. I don't think it is good for the overall M structure. Thinking of a casino as where I always lose, is not good for business.
> > Ploppers and the general public think that way. Losing quickly is not good for overall business. But maybe I am wrong there as well, and people was to win or lose fairly quickly.
> >
> > I am amazed you played for 5 hours on $100. I just see people feeding money into the games. Obviously you know this game far better than the average folk and can maintain quite well over long periods of time.
>
The 8/5 Double Double and the 6/5 Bonus were left. The Double Double also got hit for $3680 or so around 11:15.
----- Frank <frank@progressivevp.com> wrote:
3 Royals hit today that I'm aware of.
$2,300 Double Bonus
$4,300 Joker KoB
$4,100 Super Double Bonus
Leaving the highest meter at a sad pathetic $3,600. Yes that is sarcasm.
No, I don't remember the game I was very tired when I left.
~FK
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "chicken2692002" <melbedewy1226@...> wrote:
>
> What's the highest quarter progressive now?
> In dollar amounts please not percent.
>
> --- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Frank" <frank@> wrote:
> >
> > I applaud your concern for others well being, it is a trait we share. And I'm very very glad you now understand where the M got their numbers for the sign.
> >
> > Just one person getting it makes all my time on vpFREE seem worth it.
> >
> > Very Good luck to you.
> >
> > ~FK
> >
> > --- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "the7thwarrior" <Judy@> wrote: You are right, I am wrong. I never thought anyone would play these games. The sign is misleading though. THe small "up to" is ridiculous. Why don't they just say what the Royal is at, and say Progressive Quarter Royal now over $$$$$? OVER 103% return?
> > >
> > > It is now obvious I was mistaken. People will play any paytable it seems for a chance at a big jackpot.
> > >
> > > I never thought the quarter Royal would get over $4000.
> > >
> > > I DID expect not everyone would play the highest meter.
> > >
> > > Ploppers have their favorite games, and that is what they bare going to play, pay tables be damned.
> > >
> > > I just hate to see people lose their bankroll, chasing the Royal. I don't think it is good for the overall M structure. Thinking of a casino as where I always lose, is not good for business.
> > > Ploppers and the general public think that way. Losing quickly is not good for overall business. But maybe I am wrong there as well, and people was to win or lose fairly quickly.
> > >
> > > I am amazed you played for 5 hours on $100. I just see people feeding money into the games. Obviously you know this game far better than the average folk and can maintain quite well over long periods of time.
> >
>
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
When I was there 9 days ago the Joker game was at $2750 and SDBP was at $1650. DB was $1150. Either these individual games are being hit several times a week or the meters aren't moving equally. Frank, what do you think?
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Frank" <frank@...> wrote:
3 Royals hit today that I'm aware of.
$2,300 Double Bonus
$4,300 Joker KoB
$4,100 Super Double BonusLeaving the highest meter at a sad pathetic $3,600. Yes that is sarcasm.
No, I don't remember the game I was very tired when I left.
~FK
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "chicken2692002" <melbedewy1226@> wrote:
>
> What's the highest quarter progressive now?
> In dollar amounts please not percent.
>
> --- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Frank" <frank@> wrote:
> >
> > I applaud your concern for others well being, it is a trait we share. And I'm very very glad you now understand where the M got their numbers for the sign.
> >
> > Just one person getting it makes all my time on vpFREE seem worth it.
> >
> > Very Good luck to you.
> >
> > ~FK
> >
> > --- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "the7thwarrior" <Judy@> wrote: You are right, I am wrong. I never thought anyone would play these games. The sign is misleading though. THe small "up to" is ridiculous. Why don't they just say what the Royal is at, and say Progressive Quarter Royal now over $$$$$? OVER 103% return?
> > >
> > > It is now obvious I was mistaken. People will play any paytable it seems for a chance at a big jackpot.
> > >
> > > I never thought the quarter Royal would get over $4000.
> > >
> > > I DID expect not everyone would play the highest meter.
> > >
> > > Ploppers have their favorite games, and that is what they bare going to play, pay tables be damned.
> > >
> > > I just hate to see people lose their bankroll, chasing the Royal. I don't think it is good for the overall M structure. Thinking of a casino as where I always lose, is not good for business.
> > > Ploppers and the general public think that way. Losing quickly is not good for overall business. But maybe I am wrong there as well, and people was to win or lose fairly quickly.
> > >
> > > I am amazed you played for 5 hours on $100. I just see people feeding money into the games. Obviously you know this game far better than the average folk and can maintain quite well over long periods of time.
> >
>
It's working out pretty well so far on the quarters. This may turn out to be a great move by you and "Bob".
Who was the idiot playing the Double Bonus?
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Frank" <frank@...> wrote:
3 Royals hit today that I'm aware of.
$2,300 Double Bonus
$4,300 Joker KoB
$4,100 Super Double BonusLeaving the highest meter at a sad pathetic $3,600. Yes that is sarcasm.
No, I don't remember the game I was very tired when I left.
~FK
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "chicken2692002" <melbedewy1226@> wrote:
>
> What's the highest quarter progressive now?
> In dollar amounts please not percent.
>
> --- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Frank" <frank@> wrote:
> >
> > I applaud your concern for others well being, it is a trait we share. And I'm very very glad you now understand where the M got their numbers for the sign.
> >
> > Just one person getting it makes all my time on vpFREE seem worth it.
> >
> > Very Good luck to you.
> >
> > ~FK
> >
> > --- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "the7thwarrior" <Judy@> wrote: You are right, I am wrong. I never thought anyone would play these games. The sign is misleading though. THe small "up to" is ridiculous. Why don't they just say what the Royal is at, and say Progressive Quarter Royal now over $$$$$? OVER 103% return?
> > >
> > > It is now obvious I was mistaken. People will play any paytable it seems for a chance at a big jackpot.
> > >
> > > I never thought the quarter Royal would get over $4000.
> > >
> > > I DID expect not everyone would play the highest meter.
> > >
> > > Ploppers have their favorite games, and that is what they bare going to play, pay tables be damned.
> > >
> > > I just hate to see people lose their bankroll, chasing the Royal. I don't think it is good for the overall M structure. Thinking of a casino as where I always lose, is not good for business.
> > > Ploppers and the general public think that way. Losing quickly is not good for overall business. But maybe I am wrong there as well, and people was to win or lose fairly quickly.
> > >
> > > I am amazed you played for 5 hours on $100. I just see people feeding money into the games. Obviously you know this game far better than the average folk and can maintain quite well over long periods of time.
> >
>
He's far from alone. Many people seem to like playing one particular game, or perhaps variety, more than they like playing the best progressive.
----- mike <melbedewy1226@hotmail.com> wrote:
It's working out pretty well so far on the quarters. This may turn out to be a great move by you and "Bob".
Who was the idiot playing the Double Bonus?
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Frank" <frank@...> wrote:
>
> 3 Royals hit today that I'm aware of.
>
> $2,300 Double Bonus
> $4,300 Joker KoB
> $4,100 Super Double Bonus
>
> Leaving the highest meter at a sad pathetic $3,600. Yes that is sarcasm.
>
> No, I don't remember the game I was very tired when I left.
>
> ~FK
>
> --- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "chicken2692002" <melbedewy1226@> wrote:
> >
> > What's the highest quarter progressive now?
> > In dollar amounts please not percent.
> >
> > --- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Frank" <frank@> wrote:
> > >
> > > I applaud your concern for others well being, it is a trait we share. And I'm very very glad you now understand where the M got their numbers for the sign.
> > >
> > > Just one person getting it makes all my time on vpFREE seem worth it.
> > >
> > > Very Good luck to you.
> > >
> > > ~FK
> > >
> > > --- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "the7thwarrior" <Judy@> wrote: You are right, I am wrong. I never thought anyone would play these games. The sign is misleading though. THe small "up to" is ridiculous. Why don't they just say what the Royal is at, and say Progressive Quarter Royal now over $$$$$? OVER 103% return?
> > > >
> > > > It is now obvious I was mistaken. People will play any paytable it seems for a chance at a big jackpot.
> > > >
> > > > I never thought the quarter Royal would get over $4000.
> > > >
> > > > I DID expect not everyone would play the highest meter.
> > > >
> > > > Ploppers have their favorite games, and that is what they bare going to play, pay tables be damned.
> > > >
> > > > I just hate to see people lose their bankroll, chasing the Royal. I don't think it is good for the overall M structure. Thinking of a casino as where I always lose, is not good for business.
> > > > Ploppers and the general public think that way. Losing quickly is not good for overall business. But maybe I am wrong there as well, and people was to win or lose fairly quickly.
> > > >
> > > > I am amazed you played for 5 hours on $100. I just see people feeding money into the games. Obviously you know this game far better than the average folk and can maintain quite well over long periods of time.
> > >
> >
>
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
The Joker must have been at $2150. When they began, the Joker started out at $2000, the Super Double started at $1500, and the others started at $1000. Except for an occasional few cents of discrepancy, I haven't noticed any differences in progression.
----- rob.singer1111 <rob.singer1111@yahoo.com> wrote:
When I was there 9 days ago the Joker game was at $2750 and SDBP was at $1650. DB was $1150. Either these individual games are being hit several times a week or the meters aren't moving equally. Frank, what do you think?
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Frank" <frank@...> wrote:
>
> 3 Royals hit today that I'm aware of.
>
> $2,300 Double Bonus
> $4,300 Joker KoB
> $4,100 Super Double Bonus
>
> Leaving the highest meter at a sad pathetic $3,600. Yes that is sarcasm.
>
> No, I don't remember the game I was very tired when I left.
>
> ~FK
>
> --- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "chicken2692002" <melbedewy1226@> wrote:
> >
> > What's the highest quarter progressive now?
> > In dollar amounts please not percent.
> >
> > --- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Frank" <frank@> wrote:
> > >
> > > I applaud your concern for others well being, it is a trait we share. And I'm very very glad you now understand where the M got their numbers for the sign.
> > >
> > > Just one person getting it makes all my time on vpFREE seem worth it.
> > >
> > > Very Good luck to you.
> > >
> > > ~FK
> > >
> > > --- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "the7thwarrior" <Judy@> wrote: You are right, I am wrong. I never thought anyone would play these games. The sign is misleading though. THe small "up to" is ridiculous. Why don't they just say what the Royal is at, and say Progressive Quarter Royal now over $$$$$? OVER 103% return?
> > > >
> > > > It is now obvious I was mistaken. People will play any paytable it seems for a chance at a big jackpot.
> > > >
> > > > I never thought the quarter Royal would get over $4000.
> > > >
> > > > I DID expect not everyone would play the highest meter.
> > > >
> > > > Ploppers have their favorite games, and that is what they bare going to play, pay tables be damned.
> > > >
> > > > I just hate to see people lose their bankroll, chasing the Royal. I don't think it is good for the overall M structure. Thinking of a casino as where I always lose, is not good for business.
> > > > Ploppers and the general public think that way. Losing quickly is not good for overall business. But maybe I am wrong there as well, and people was to win or lose fairly quickly.
> > > >
> > > > I am amazed you played for 5 hours on $100. I just see people feeding money into the games. Obviously you know this game far better than the average folk and can maintain quite well over long periods of time.
> > >
> >
>
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Fortunately "thinking isn't required". I was there when 3 of the low Royals were hit over the course of several days, so I saw it with my own eyes.
Your first assumption is correct. They are being hit frequently due to game preference. The meters move equally...or at least they did when I checked each individual machine late at night and reported discrepancies to the casino which were immediately fixed. Five machines had broken progressive links. This was resolved.
About a week ago I checked them all again, and all was well.
People simply aren't always playing the highest game.
It is unexpected (at least to me) and it makes it even better for people that do always play the highest meter, because it tends to pump them up far beyond what was anticipated. The extra money for the smart people is coming directly out of the pockets of the less informed. It is important to note this extra return comes not from the casino's pocket. An equatable exchange, I think most would agree...especially live poker players who are used to the practice of paying the casino a rake for the opportunity to take money from those less skillful than themselves.
~FK
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "rob.singer1111" <rob.singer1111@...> wrote: When I was there 9 days ago the Joker game was at $2750 and SDBP was at $1650. DB was $1150. Either these individual games are being hit several times a week or the meters aren't moving equally. Frank, what do you think?
OK thanks Frank--that all makes sense.
When you infer that people should always be playing the highest royaled game, what you're saying is they should be playing for the sole purpose of hitting that royal, no? I think that's where these games have a huge negative to them (although there is a positive). We're tossing all these large 25c royal figures around here like it was the day before Christmas, yet a lot of people are going to simply lose lots of money chasing them because of the poor paytables. And when the dollar games get up there and we start seeing $20,000+ figures being posted, well, you know what I mean.
When I got all the positive games put into the Wynn a few years back, (also 25c/50c/$1) and I was still writing for Gaming Today, just after they pulled them due to teams hogging them from hotel guests, eating meals at the machines etc., I asked for and was given a review of exactly how much they made for the casino and I published the figures. I think if you could get such numbers from the M it would be even more interesting, given the large royals and all. Do you think that's possible?
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Frank" <frank@...> wrote:
Fortunately "thinking isn't required". I was there when 3 of the low Royals were hit over the course of several days, so I saw it with my own eyes.
Your first assumption is correct. They are being hit frequently due to game preference. The meters move equally...or at least they did when I checked each individual machine late at night and reported discrepancies to the casino which were immediately fixed. Five machines had broken progressive links. This was resolved.
About a week ago I checked them all again, and all was well.
People simply aren't always playing the highest game.
It is unexpected (at least to me) and it makes it even better for people that do always play the highest meter, because it tends to pump them up far beyond what was anticipated. The extra money for the smart people is coming directly out of the pockets of the less informed. It is important to note this extra return comes not from the casino's pocket. An equatable exchange, I think most would agree...especially live poker players who are used to the practice of paying the casino a rake for the opportunity to take money from those less skillful than themselves.
~FK
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "rob.singer1111" <rob.singer1111@> wrote: When I was there 9 days ago the Joker game was at $2750 and SDBP was at $1650. DB was $1150. Either these individual games are being hit several times a week or the meters aren't moving equally. Frank, what do you think?
Gosh I have no idea. Of course I didn't think it was possible to do what has already been done.
Guess it can't hurt to ask.
~FK
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "rob.singer1111" <rob.singer1111@...> wrote: When I got all the positive games put into the Wynn a few years back, (also 25c/50c/$1) and I was still writing for Gaming Today, just after they pulled them due to teams hogging them from hotel guests, eating meals at the machines etc., I asked for and was given a review of exactly how much they made for the casino and I published the figures. I think if you could get such numbers from the M it would be even more interesting, given the large royals and all. Do you think that's possible?
Who was the idiot playing the Double Bonus?
-----Original Message----- From: mike
Subject: [vpFREE] Re: The New Progressives At The M
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Frank" <frank@...> wrote:
3 Royals hit today that I'm aware of.
$2,300 Double Bonus
$4,300 Joker KoB
$4,100 Super Double Bonus
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Why would he be the "idiot"? Based on the reported $4,300 & $2,300 royals for KBJW and DB respectively, the joker definitely had an expected return of almost exactly 4% higher than the DB. Most people in this group will likely agree that VP is mathematics, but certainly more than a single calculation. In the two games above at the level that they were hit, the joker player was fighting a variance number of 340, while the DB player only 120, just a bit more than 1/3 the joker game. The royal cycle, another consideration while playing progressives,was 10 percent more hands for the KBJW game (just like most wild card games) than was the cycle for the DB game. If you consider limiting your play on either game to five or six hours, the likelihood of hitting the top two payoffs in either game is severely reduced. In KBJW, without a royal or a five of a kind, the average long term hourly loss for an 800 HPH player will be around $80. For the DB player who does not score a royal or a straight flush, considerably less, at around $68.50 per hour. I am not making any judgments on anything here, but as has been posted many times , return is not the only consideration for making a game choice. For those with limited finances, bankroll protection is a big factor if you are just taking a limited shot at a progressive. I play a lot on progressive games, and I will usually ponder all of the above variables when choosing a game. There are many play by the seat of your pants progressive players out there that none of the above will apply to. These are the folks that, when you mention EV, they may think that you are referring to the oil that Rachael Ray adds to her salads. I assume that most of our members are above that talent level. Not knowing the player who was hit by the DB royal, and therefore having no clue as to their goals, how can we judge an intelligence level? They may have been thinking that playing a game that has a similar return to JOB, close to break even without the mailer, may improve their BB. One thing I am sure of is that the person who walked with the $2,300 hand pay probably does not consider themselves an idiot.
Nudge
I definitely agree that he did not feel like an idiot when he collected his 23 pictures of Mr. Franklin...
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "nudge51" <nudge51@...> wrote:
-----Original Message-----
From: mike
Subject: [vpFREE] Re: The New Progressives At The MWho was the idiot playing the Double Bonus?
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Frank" <frank@> wrote:
>
> 3 Royals hit today that I'm aware of.
>
> $2,300 Double Bonus
> $4,300 Joker KoB
> $4,100 Super Double Bonus
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Why would he be the "idiot"? Based on the reported $4,300 & $2,300 royals
for KBJW and DB respectively, the joker definitely had an expected return of
almost exactly 4% higher than the DB. Most people in this group will likely
agree that VP is mathematics, but certainly more than a single calculation.
In the two games above at the level that they were hit, the joker player was
fighting a variance number of 340, while the DB player only 120, just a bit
more than 1/3 the joker game. The royal cycle, another consideration while
playing progressives,was 10 percent more hands for the KBJW game (just like
most wild card games) than was the cycle for the DB game. If you consider
limiting your play on either game to five or six hours, the likelihood of
hitting the top two payoffs in either game is severely reduced. In KBJW,
without a royal or a five of a kind, the average long term hourly loss for
an 800 HPH player will be around $80. For the DB player who does not score
a royal or a straight flush, considerably less, at around $68.50 per hour.
I am not making any judgments on anything here, but as has been posted many
times , return is not the only consideration for making a game choice. For
those with limited finances, bankroll protection is a big factor if you are
just taking a limited shot at a progressive. I play a lot on progressive
games, and I will usually ponder all of the above variables when choosing
a game. There are many play by the seat of your pants progressive players
out there that none of the above will apply to. These are the folks that,
when you mention EV, they may think that you are referring to the oil that
Rachael Ray adds to her salads. I assume that most of our members are above
that talent level. Not knowing the player who was hit by the DB royal, and
therefore having no clue as to their goals, how can we judge an intelligence
level? They may have been thinking that playing a game that has a similar
return to JOB, close to break even without the mailer, may improve their BB.
One thing I am sure of is that the person who walked with the $2,300 hand
pay probably does not consider themselves an idiot.
Nudge
Another point being seemingly overlooked is that people are going to play
games which they know the best. While I might be able to play JoB nearly
perfect and only give up .4% in equity long term (just an example), that
doesn't mean I should play a machine that is theoretically 102% vs 99.7% of
JoB if I can only play a game on the 102% at 98% in actual return. Some
games are much more difficult to master.
On Wed, Jun 1, 2011 at 9:03 PM, mike <melbedewy1226@hotmail.com> wrote:
I definitely agree that he did not feel like an idiot when he collected his
23 pictures of Mr. Franklin...--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "nudge51" <nudge51@...> wrote:
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: mike
> Subject: [vpFREE] Re: The New Progressives At The M
>
> Who was the idiot playing the Double Bonus?
> --- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Frank" <frank@> wrote:
> >
> > 3 Royals hit today that I'm aware of.
> >
> > $2,300 Double Bonus
> > $4,300 Joker KoB
> > $4,100 Super Double Bonus
> ----------------------------------------------------------
> Why would he be the "idiot"? Based on the reported $4,300 & $2,300 royals> for KBJW and DB respectively, the joker definitely had an expected return
of
> almost exactly 4% higher than the DB. Most people in this group will
likely
> agree that VP is mathematics, but certainly more than a single
calculation.
> In the two games above at the level that they were hit, the joker player
was
> fighting a variance number of 340, while the DB player only 120, just a
bit
> more than 1/3 the joker game. The royal cycle, another consideration
while
> playing progressives,was 10 percent more hands for the KBJW game (just
like
> most wild card games) than was the cycle for the DB game. If you consider> limiting your play on either game to five or six hours, the likelihood of
> hitting the top two payoffs in either game is severely reduced. In KBJW,
> without a royal or a five of a kind, the average long term hourly loss
for
> an 800 HPH player will be around $80. For the DB player who does not
score
> a royal or a straight flush, considerably less, at around $68.50 per
hour.
> I am not making any judgments on anything here, but as has been posted
many
> times , return is not the only consideration for making a game choice.
For
> those with limited finances, bankroll protection is a big factor if you
are
> just taking a limited shot at a progressive. I play a lot on progressive
> games, and I will usually ponder all of the above variables when choosing> a game. There are many play by the seat of your pants progressive players
> out there that none of the above will apply to. These are the folks that,
> when you mention EV, they may think that you are referring to the oil
that
> Rachael Ray adds to her salads. I assume that most of our members are
above
> that talent level. Not knowing the player who was hit by the DB royal,
and
> therefore having no clue as to their goals, how can we judge an
intelligence
> level? They may have been thinking that playing a game that has a similar> return to JOB, close to break even without the mailer, may improve their
BB.
> One thing I am sure of is that the person who walked with the $2,300 hand> pay probably does not consider themselves an idiot.
>
> Nudge
>
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Or was it 22 Benjies and 5 Andys?
I definitely agree that he did not feel like an idiot when he collected his 23
pictures of Mr. Franklin...
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]