I don't think anyone would dispute that a tax system is required to
have a non third world country but the implementation will always be
unfair. This is because politicians implement social polity ( for
example, encourageing home ownership, charitable contributions and
raising children while disouraging market speculation, raiding your
retirement fund too early etc) via tax policy. In addtion, easy
targets (smokers, drinkers, gamblers, ex-pats) get exploited while
harder targets (anyone who can afford a lobbiest) get an easier
ride. Welcome to dollar Democracy. It's also why we'll never have
a flat tax. The pols would lose their ability to grant favors for
money.
P.S. granting that the system is unfair, I've yet to see a better
system. Every other example I've seen in other countries seems too
extreme one way or the other. You either get soaked so every
grandma has a social worker need it or not, or you have dirt roads
in the capital.
I expect this to be my last post on this non-VP topic, but I have
to
say I am a bit surprised by all of the defenders of the U.S. tax
system (a system that is almost universally recognized as being at
best unnecessarily complex and inefficient).
Of course I know it's not a pay as you use it system. And I won't
be
one of those retirees that complains about my taxes going to the
local schools despite the fact that my kids will be long out of
them. I understand that people in Nevada and Florida (among other
states) don't pay state income tax because of the tourists in
those
states. Is that fair? Who's to say? I realize that taxes are
for
the greater good, in fact I probably lean toward socialist views
more
than the average person. But the U.S. tax system is extremely
unfair, not just for my situation. Does it make sense that
machine
gamblers get W2G's but not table players? Or that the threshold
hasn't increased with inflation (the paperwork of the W2G is
another
fine example of IRS efficiency!). Does it make sense that the
rich
people can take advantage of all the loopholes? I challenge
anyone
to make the case for taxing the income of both U.S. citizens
living
and working abroad and ALSO foreigners living and working in the
U.S. And yes there are some exclusions but for many of us that
doesn't even come close to compensating for the higher cost of
living
(my rent for a 3-bedroom house is $7500 a month!).
And here's the part that the government doesn't seem to
understand.
As you said, it's my decision, and I'm only going to work abroad
if
it makes sense for me. But by making it more and more
disadvantageous (the latest was a change to the taxation of
deferred
income that was thrown into the big bailout bill Congress passed a
few months ago), companies have to pay more and more to make it
worthwhile for Americans. What do you think these companies are
doing? They are choosing to employ Canadians, Brits, Australians,
or
anyone else that can make it work for less money. It costs too
much
to make it appealing for Americans (the only reason I still have
my
job is that I'm already here and there is a cost to bringing
someone
new in). As Congress continues to make these changes, many of the
millions of Americans now living abroad will be moving back to the
States to compete for jobs there. Is that what they want to
happen?
Anyway, I don't have the time to continue to argue about the
unfairness of the U.S. tax system! Here's a link to a story that
pretty much sums up the effectiveness of the IRS:
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/nation/6193147.html
>
>
> It isn't a "pay as you use it" system for U.S. citizens. I
don't
get to pick and choose what taxes I pay based on what I use. If I
didn't visit a national park in 2008 I don't get to deduct a
portion
of my tax obligation for not availing myself of a portion of the
services the government provides. I chose to not visit a national
park last year, but I could have gone to my heart's content. You
choose to live outside the country. Nothing wrong with your
decision
at all, but it's your decision.
>
>
>
> To: vpFREE@: larsonsm@: Wed, 7 Jan 2009 14:22:21
+0000Subject: [vpFREE] Re: Taxes and citizenship, was another W2G
question...
>
>
>
> Obviously what you say is true, and I am not unhappy to be an
American citizen. And I would gladly pay some taxes for those
rights
that I maintain. But can anyone really say it is fair to pay a
full
complement of taxes when you don't live in the country? And if you
do
somehow think it is fair, then how can you justify the fact that
the
U.S. also fully taxes foreigners who live and work in the U.S.
Come
on, you can't have it both ways!--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com,
b.glazer@ wrote:>> > 7.4. Re: another W2G question... > > Date:
Tue
Jan 6, 2009 7:35 am ((PST)) > > > > True. But it is my
understanding
that my tax dollars are used for > > more than just guaranteeing
my
right to eventually return (and use > > U.S. embassies when
traveling
abroad, and a few other "perks" of > > owning a U.S. passport).
The
U.S. is the only country in the world > > that taxes its non-
residents. And without starting another political > > discussion,
it's been getting worse and can't see it getting better > > any
time
soon given the current deficit... > > > > I expect this discussion
will be barred from the list before too much longer, but before it
is...> > All of us who pay taxes support some governmental
activities
which we would not otherwise support with our money. This is also
true when we join organizations, which spend our dues dollars in
ways
that we might not otherwise choose.> > If you want to boycott the
country, or any other organization, you can "drop your
membership" -
in the case of citizenship, it might involve a requirement
to "join"
···
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "larsonsm" <larsonsm@...> wrote:
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, David Silvus <djsilvus@> wrote:
a different country -- where I expect you'll again find yourself
taxed, possibly at a higher rate than here.> > Maybe you can start
your own country :)> > But if there is a better way, and you're
unhappy with your US citizenship and US taxes, I'm sure there are
solutions for you -- and if you have not availed yourself of them,
I'm sure there are reasons for that as well.> > --BG> >
================>
>
>
>
>
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Windows LiveTM: Keep your life in sync.
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>
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