vpFREE2 Forums

Tax info - 1099s version W2Gs

I was recently audited and was told 1099s, even if they come because you won
a drawing where you earned more entries by gambling, have to be reported as
separate Misc-1099s, which cannot be offset by gambling losses. This goes on
a different line than W2G/gambling winnings.

The IRS requirements for gambling are a gray area. If you are audited and
claim anything other than total of W2gs for Gambling Income and 1099-Misc. as
additional miscellaneous income, you probably will have to go to the appeals
process - where you may or may not win.

On the other hand, many people do lump W2Gs/other gambling
income/gambling-related-1099s together into Gambling Income, and offset this with gambling
losses. And most are never audited.

If the amount of your Gambling Income is low, you may never be audited. If
your gambling income is higher, so is the chance of being audited, and if
your W2G total is different from your listed Gambling Income, you are also more
likely to be audited.

Should you be audited and end up agreeing with IRS or losing an appeals, you
will have to pay interest on the extra taxes you owe, and this can add up.
You may possibly also be due to pay penalties.

We didn't receive a letter audit for 2004 until April or so 2006. As of
Jan. 2007 we have finally settled with the IRS after several mishaps including
them pretty much ignoring or not receiving replies. We ended up agreeing with
the IRS, rather than go through a even more lengthy appeals process which we
may or may not have won, and possibly hiring a tax expert to help at rates
of $150-250 or more per hour. In the end we paid $4500 more in taxes and
about $500 more in interest! As you can see, interest adds up. We had used
Gambling Session methods for our taxes, rather than W2Gs, which resulted in a
lower total for Gambling Income than W2Gs. We also had a very large amount of
W2Gs. We also lumped gambling-related-1099-Misc. with W2Gs.

While it may seem that $5000 more in taxes is a lot to pay, if we had hired
someone to help prepare an appeals, that could have cost quite a bit of that
amount. Also we had no way of knowing whether in the end we would have lost
or not, and thus interest would have continued to mount. And the stress
level was already very high.

As a result of this, I am now gambling far far less, and hoping to avoid
W2Gs and tax problems in the future.

As inflation has pushed more people into getting W2Gs, and as gambling has
spread, it is more and more clear that tax laws need to be rewritten.
Unfortunately there doesn't seem to be anyone really advocating for this for
gamblers. You'd think casinos would be pushing for changes, but so far I don't see
any evidence of this.

Meanwhile more average gamblers may find themselves audited by an IRS system
that provides pat answers and doesn't really understand gambling activities.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Casinos want our money, but they don't support us in
any way or manner to make gambling a fair game.
Apparently they agree with IRS and Government to
share in this windfall of easy money. You are correct
to say that we will have change our gambling habits to
avoid g W2Gs and 1099s by gambling less at lower
limits and wait to see what the Casinos will do.
Vet.

···

--- misscraps@aol.com wrote:

I was recently audited and was told 1099s, even if
they come because you won
a drawing where you earned more entries by gambling,
have to be reported as
separate Misc-1099s, which cannot be offset by
gambling losses. This goes on
a different line than W2G/gambling winnings.

The IRS requirements for gambling are a gray area.
If you are audited and
claim anything other than total of W2gs for Gambling
Income and 1099-Misc. as
additional miscellaneous income, you probably will
have to go to the appeals
process - where you may or may not win.

On the other hand, many people do lump W2Gs/other
gambling
income/gambling-related-1099s together into Gambling
Income, and offset this with gambling
losses. And most are never audited.

If the amount of your Gambling Income is low, you
may never be audited. If
your gambling income is higher, so is the chance of
being audited, and if
your W2G total is different from your listed
Gambling Income, you are also more
likely to be audited.

Should you be audited and end up agreeing with IRS
or losing an appeals, you
will have to pay interest on the extra taxes you
owe, and this can add up.
You may possibly also be due to pay penalties.

We didn't receive a letter audit for 2004 until
April or so 2006. As of
Jan. 2007 we have finally settled with the IRS after
several mishaps including
them pretty much ignoring or not receiving replies.
We ended up agreeing with
the IRS, rather than go through a even more lengthy
appeals process which we
may or may not have won, and possibly hiring a tax
expert to help at rates
of $150-250 or more per hour. In the end we paid
$4500 more in taxes and
about $500 more in interest! As you can see,
interest adds up. We had used
Gambling Session methods for our taxes, rather than
W2Gs, which resulted in a
lower total for Gambling Income than W2Gs. We also
had a very large amount of
W2Gs. We also lumped gambling-related-1099-Misc.
with W2Gs.

While it may seem that $5000 more in taxes is a lot
to pay, if we had hired
someone to help prepare an appeals, that could have
cost quite a bit of that
amount. Also we had no way of knowing whether in
the end we would have lost
or not, and thus interest would have continued to
mount. And the stress
level was already very high.

As a result of this, I am now gambling far far less,
and hoping to avoid
W2Gs and tax problems in the future.

As inflation has pushed more people into getting
W2Gs, and as gambling has
spread, it is more and more clear that tax laws need
to be rewritten.
Unfortunately there doesn't seem to be anyone really
advocating for this for
gamblers. You'd think casinos would be pushing for
changes, but so far I don't see
any evidence of this.

Meanwhile more average gamblers may find themselves
audited by an IRS system
that provides pat answers and doesn't really
understand gambling activities.

[Non-text portions of this message have been
removed]

____________________________________________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Everyone is raving about the all-new Yahoo! Mail beta.
http://new.mail.yahoo.com

Isn't there a lobbying group for the gaming industry? I think I
remember there being one with Frank Farenkamp being the director, or
something like that. They should be lobbying to get W2G's updated for
inflation. If they had been updated for inflation the threshold for a
W2G would be like $6,000 right now. As it is now it is just a
pointless piece of busywork for the casinos. A huge number of them are
earned on penny machines! They should update the W2G's for inflation
and then they should be automatically updated for inflation every year.

···

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, vet <vet611@...> wrote:

Casinos want our money, but they don't support us in
any way or manner to make gambling a fair game.
Apparently they agree with IRS and Government to
share in this windfall of easy money. You are correct
to say that we will have change our gambling habits to
avoid g W2Gs and 1099s by gambling less at lower
limits and wait to see what the Casinos will do.
Vet.
--- misscraps@... wrote:

You're thinking of Frank Fahrenkopf, Jr. He is the President and CEO
of the American Gaming Association.

I beg to differ with you on the threshhold amount of the W-2Gs. IMHO,
any effort to increase the amount would be looked upon as a way to
avoid paying the appropriate taxes on gaming winnings. It'll never
happen.

A more realistic campaign would be to clarify the tax code related to
gaming winnings and losses. Topics to be discussed could include:

-Definition of a session (never defined in the IRS regs)

-Definition of what to include in gaming wins (cash back, bounce-back
cash, 1099s related to gaming activity)

-Definitions of what not to include in gaming wins (food comps, room
comps)

-Exclusion of gross gaming wins when calculating adjusted gross income

-Ability to deduct gaming losses (up to the amount of gaming wins)
without itemizing deductions

I'm sure there are other topics as well...

Don the Dentist

···

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "markhaslem" <markhaslem@...> wrote:

Isn't there a lobbying group for the gaming industry? I think I
remember there being one with Frank Farenkamp being the director, or
something like that. They should be lobbying to get W2G's updated
for inflation. If they had been updated for inflation the threshold
for a W2G would be like $6,000 right now.

I agree with all that is listed below, as do, I am sure, all of us
who are members of this group. But similar to the objection to
raising the limit for W2-G's, it will never happen. There will
never even be meaningful dialog by the powers that be. It
is "sinful gambling" (again, tongue in cheek) and logic will never
prevail. In my opinion, of course.

.....bl

A more realistic campaign would be to clarify the tax code related

to

gaming winnings and losses. Topics to be discussed could include:

-Definition of a session (never defined in the IRS regs)

-Definition of what to include in gaming wins (cash back, bounce-

back

cash, 1099s related to gaming activity)

-Definitions of what not to include in gaming wins (food comps,

room

comps)

-Exclusion of gross gaming wins when calculating adjusted gross

income

···

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "dds2124" <dds6@...> wrote:

-Ability to deduct gaming losses (up to the amount of gaming wins)
without itemizing deductions

I'm sure there are other topics as well...

Don the Dentist