vpFREE2 Forums

Social Security Number

#1

Can a casino automatically deduct 28% for the IRS if you do not
show them your social security card?

The privacy act of 1974 states
"In response to growing concerns over the accumulation of massive
amounts of personal information, Congress passed the Privacy Act of
1974. Among other things, this Act makes it unlawful for a
governmental agency to deny a right, benefit, or privilege merely
because the individual refuses to disclose his SSN".

  I do not know where my socail security card is and I cannot
remember the last time I have seen or used it. However, a local
indian casino refused to pay a $4,000 royal since I did not have a
SS card with me. They said I had 72 hours to prove the number I
provided is accurate. The payoff personnel were not sure of
everything they would accept and really wanted me to bring back my
SS card. They thought a W-2 or payroll check would be accepted.
Being retired and self employed in the past made that a questionable
option.
  I guess I will apply for a new card and tomorrow I will return
with a few items with my number on and hope they accept one of them.
Do they have the right to simple call all the shots? It is an
Arizona indian casino. I guess they are an "Indian Nation" with
all the powers that must go with that sovereignty. I not upset,
but earlier in the year another Arizona indian casino managed by
Harrah's did not require me to show them my SS card.

Thanks,
Bob

#2

Tonight we ate at the Fiesta Rancho cafe. Between the two of us we had one order of fish & chips, one prime rib, one glass of wine, and one iced tea. The bill pre-tax (I paid with points) was $22.22.
Needless to say, it was the only "2222" I had all night. I will order something different next time.
-- Steve in LV

#3

Futrend wrote:

The privacy act of 1974 states
"In response to growing concerns over the accumulation of massive
amounts of personal information, Congress passed the Privacy Act of
1974. Among other things, this Act makes it unlawful for a
governmental agency to deny a right, benefit, or privilege merely
because the individual refuses to disclose his SSN".
The operative phrase here being "refuses to disclose his SSN." You
apparently did not refuse.

"The payoff personnel were not sure of
everything they would accept and really wanted me to bring back my
SS card. They thought a W-2 or payroll check would be accepted.
Being retired and self employed in the past made that a questionable
option.
  I guess I will apply for a new card and tomorrow I will return
with a few items with my number on and hope they accept one of them.
Do they have the right to simple call all the shots? It is an
Arizona indian casino. I guess they are an "Indian Nation" with
all the powers that must go with that sovereignty.
That "sovereignty" is supposed to be limited by their compact with the state
they are situated in. A much stranger spectacle is that of a "foreign
nation" withholding taxes on Americans. They don't do that in Canada,
France, Mexico, Britain or too many other places I know of.

#4

If you like to play DB, avoid ordering the $11.11 special of the day!
-Babe-

···

----------------------------------------

-- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Steve Del Nero" <artcontrol@c...> wrote:
Tonight we ate at the Fiesta Rancho cafe. Between the two of us we
had one order of fish & chips, one prime rib, one glass of wine, and
one iced tea. The bill pre-tax (I paid with points) was $22.22.
Needless to say, it was the only "2222" I had all night. I will
order something different next time.
-- Steve in LV

#5

A couple of things:

-A casino isn't a government agency.

-You are going to pay the same amount of taxes anyway, the interest on
the difference amounts to approximately 30 dollars (assuming that the
extra jackpot doesn't force you to pay estimated tax).

-Technically, what you probably need to show is a TIN (Tax ID Number),
not an SSN. SSNs are TINs, but not all TINs are SSNs. My wife isn't
eligible for an SSN, but she has a TIN (long story). I wouldn't trust
casino employees to understand the subtle difference.

JBQ

···

On 9/12/05, futrend <futrend@yahoo.com> wrote:

  Can a casino automatically deduct 28% for the IRS if you do not
show them your social security card?

#6

I've visited about 6 casinos in AZ. All of them have
asked if I had my SS card, I told them no, but I gave
them my number for the W2-G and a drivers license. No
problem.

I don't carry anything with my SSN on me. i think that
is just asking for identity problems if you lose it.

Mark

···

--- MHS <mspevack@netcarrier.com> wrote:

Futrend wrote:

The privacy act of 1974 states
"In response to growing concerns over the
accumulation of massive
amounts of personal information, Congress passed the
Privacy Act of
1974. Among other things, this Act makes it unlawful
for a
governmental agency to deny a right, benefit, or
privilege merely
because the individual refuses to disclose his SSN".
The operative phrase here being "refuses to disclose
his SSN." You
apparently did not refuse.

"The payoff personnel were not sure of
everything they would accept and really wanted me to
bring back my
SS card. They thought a W-2 or payroll check would
be accepted.
Being retired and self employed in the past made
that a questionable
option.
  I guess I will apply for a new card and tomorrow I
will return
with a few items with my number on and hope they
accept one of them.
Do they have the right to simple call all the shots?
It is an
Arizona indian casino. I guess they are an "Indian
Nation" with
all the powers that must go with that sovereignty.
That "sovereignty" is supposed to be limited by
their compact with the state
they are situated in. A much stranger spectacle is
that of a "foreign
nation" withholding taxes on Americans. They don't
do that in Canada,
France, Mexico, Britain or too many other places I
know of.

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#7

Just to put another spin on the SS issue...and I'm not advocating yes or no
to put SS on your license...

On more than one occasion I've found slips of paper in the casino with a
persons name and SS on it left by casino personnel. If your SS is on your
drivers license you at least won't have THAT happening to you.

···

-----Original Message-----
From: vpFREE@yahoogroups.com [mailto:vpF…@…com] On Behalf Of
Mark Marsh
Sent: Monday, September 12, 2005 8:00 PM
To: vpFREE@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [vpFREE] Social Security Number

I've visited about 6 casinos in AZ. All of them have
asked if I had my SS card, I told them no, but I gave
them my number for the W2-G and a drivers license. No
problem.

I don't carry anything with my SSN on me. i think that
is just asking for identity problems if you lose it.

Mark

--- MHS <mspevack@netcarrier.com> wrote:

Futrend wrote:

The privacy act of 1974 states
"In response to growing concerns over the
accumulation of massive
amounts of personal information, Congress passed the
Privacy Act of
1974. Among other things, this Act makes it unlawful
for a
governmental agency to deny a right, benefit, or
privilege merely
because the individual refuses to disclose his SSN".
The operative phrase here being "refuses to disclose
his SSN." You
apparently did not refuse.

"The payoff personnel were not sure of
everything they would accept and really wanted me to
bring back my
SS card. They thought a W-2 or payroll check would
be accepted.
Being retired and self employed in the past made
that a questionable
option.
  I guess I will apply for a new card and tomorrow I
will return
with a few items with my number on and hope they
accept one of them.
Do they have the right to simple call all the shots?
It is an
Arizona indian casino. I guess they are an "Indian
Nation" with
all the powers that must go with that sovereignty.
That "sovereignty" is supposed to be limited by
their compact with the state
they are situated in. A much stranger spectacle is
that of a "foreign
nation" withholding taxes on Americans. They don't
do that in Canada,
France, Mexico, Britain or too many other places I
know of.

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#8

No so now at Fort McDowell! Policies can changed. No SS card
means no payment. You have 72 hours to produce a card or other
acceptable information like a W2 or a payroll check with your name,
address and SS# on the information. This may not have been their
policy in the past. I have order a replacement card. Now I only
wish I get a chance to use it!

Bob

···

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, Mark Marsh <butnpushr@y...> wrote:

I've visited about 6 casinos in AZ. All of them have
asked if I had my SS card, I told them no, but I gave
them my number for the W2-G and a drivers license. No
problem.

I don't carry anything with my SSN on me. i think that
is just asking for identity problems if you lose it.

Mark

--- MHS <mspevack@n...> wrote:

> Futrend wrote:
>
> The privacy act of 1974 states
> "In response to growing concerns over the
> accumulation of massive
> amounts of personal information, Congress passed the
> Privacy Act of
> 1974. Among other things, this Act makes it unlawful

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#9

<<No SS card means no payment. You have 72 hours to produce a card or other
acceptable information like a W2 or a payroll check with your name, address
and SS# on the information.>>

Signing a W9 form is sufficient proof of your TIN. If they tried not paying
me they would be in court so fast it would make their headdress spin and the
newspapers would LOVE the story.

Cogno

#10

When dealing with Indian casinos I think there is alot of uncharted
territory. Can they be sued? I don't know that they are subject to
US courts, and could 'hide' behind their sovereignty. I guess in the
case of taxes they have agreed with the state or the feds to coincide
with reporting/ withholding regulations.

I would expect that they could not pay a person, and not have any real
repercussion except the bad press.

#11

They may be harassing you. If they can't produce the precise federal
regulation that requires the actual showing of a card, then I would strongly
consider taking my business elsewhere.

···

-----Original Message-----
From: vpFREE@yahoogroups.com [mailto:vpF…@…com]On Behalf Of
futrend
Sent: Tuesday, September 13, 2005 12:42 PM
To: vpFREE@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [vpFREE] Re: Social Security Number

  No so now at Fort McDowell! Policies can changed. No SS card
means no payment. You have 72 hours to produce a card or other
acceptable information like a W2 or a payroll check with your name,
address and SS# on the information. This may not have been their
policy in the past. I have order a replacement card. Now I only
wish I get a chance to use it!

Bob

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, Mark Marsh <butnpushr@y...> wrote:

I've visited about 6 casinos in AZ. All of them have
asked if I had my SS card, I told them no, but I gave
them my number for the W2-G and a drivers license. No
problem.

I don't carry anything with my SSN on me. i think that
is just asking for identity problems if you lose it.

Mark

--- MHS <mspevack@n...> wrote:

> Futrend wrote:
>
> The privacy act of 1974 states
> "In response to growing concerns over the
> accumulation of massive
> amounts of personal information, Congress passed the
> Privacy Act of
> 1974. Among other things, this Act makes it unlawful

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