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There are lots of kinds of "semi-barrings" that take place. For me at
both the MGM Grand and the Venetian, they let me continue to play but
removed about half of the slot club benefits --- i.e. holiday gift
points and all tier bonuses on cash back. And they informed me I would
no longer receive the better invitations for events. The net effect was
that I voluntarily stayed away because I no longer could play the game
at an advantage.
After I was dealt an $80,000 royal at Wynn, I was told I'd no longer get
any promotional offers (like weekly direct mail cash-back). Since the
base slot club is only worth 0.22%, that makes 9/6 Jacks unplayable
without the extra offers. Shirley also was dealt an $80,000 royal there,
but her offers continued for a little while --- until she hit enough
other royals.
Shortly after they opened, the Palms stopped sending direct mail to a
few dozen people on the G.M.'s list that he'd developed over the years
by being the G.M. elsewhere. I was included on this list --- except I
was also teaching video poker classes there at the time. I convinced
George Maloof that I would be a more effective teacher if I received the
mailers and knew what promotions were going on. He agreed and I started
receiving mailers again. They stopped classes there after another
semester or so, but I've remained welcome to play there.
Coast casinos first eliminated all discretionary comps --- and then
later they invalidated our slot club cards from getting future points.
They let us cash out the old points, however.
Sometimes casinos change their mind --- frequently because they have
changed managers. Each manager has his/her own ideas about the best way
to deal with strong players. Caesars Palace, for example, kicked out
several players, including me, but later started sending us offers
again. Now I get all of their top-tier offers.
Absolutely none of these "barrings" --- if that's what you call them ---
were done in writing. There is no way I can "prove" that any of these
things happened other than indirectly. There are players on vpFREE who
play at the MGM Grand, Mirage, Bellagio, Venetian, Wynn, Gold Coast,
Orleans, Suncoast and/or Golden Nugget who can testify that they don't
see me there during any of the promotions. The ones who know Shirley
know that she LOVES to go on cruises and that we would qualify for two
or three a year if we were eligible. I suggest reasonable people would
conclude that the main reason I don't attend promotions at the casinos
named is because I'm not invited.
It's neither fun nor profitable to be restricted. But it's inevitable if
you play big and are successful. Big royal flushes (say $40,000 and
higher, or perhaps $100,000 and higher) get the attention of casino
bosses and players who've received a lot of these irritate these bosses.
Although the timing of royals is largely luck, and the number of royals
you've hit is highly (albeit imperfectly) correlated with the number of
hours you've played, and the size of royals is directly related to the
stakes you play, many casino bosses use these royals as a barometer to
restrict players.
If you can limit your play to $5 video poker and lower, you'll last
longer. At smaller casinos, you might need to limit your play to $1 and
lower. And sometimes even lower than that.
Sometimes being "Bob Dancer" has helped my longevity at casinos and
sometimes it has hurt. If casinos are looking to crack down on skilled
players, I'm an easy one to identify because I identify myself as an
expert in a number of ways. It's impossible to read my Tuesday
casinogaming.com oolumns without concluding that I'm a knowledgeable
player. There are other players (including some that post here) who are
every bit as knowledgeable as me at the game (some more so) but who've
managed to keep a lower profile. Casino bosses have a tougher time
identifying these people as experts, so their longevity is greater.
Bob Dancer
For a 3-day free trial of Video Poker for Winners, the best video poker
computer trainer ever invented, go to //www.videopokerforwinners.com
That wasn't my experience at all. I hit a $5 royal at the Mirage last
December and had a three-royal draw on a $1 Spin Poker machine last
April. (It is not unusual to get multiple royals on a SP machine when
you finally do get a royal).
I haven't received an offer since.
Mr. Dancer responded to a post I made about being barred that the
Mirage would not be concerned about a player at my "low" level.
Therefore, it had to be some kind of a computer glitch or careless
mistake.
But a follow-up conversation with my host last July confirmed indeed
that until I returned to the Mirage and showed a loss there would be
no direct mail offers issued.
I haven't, they haven't, and end of story.
I repeat a post I made recently: Casinos do not like winners, and,
given identical coin-in to the break-even or losing partner beside
you, the future offers winners receive will be worse.
AT ALL LEVELS.
And that's assuming, of course, that offers are even extended.
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Bob Dancer" <bdancer@...> wrote:
Although the timing of royals is largely luck, and the number of
royals you've hit is highly (albeit imperfectly) correlated with
the number of hours you've played, and the size of royals is
directly related to the stakes you play, many casino bosses use
these royals as a barometer to restrict players.
If you can limit your play to $5 video poker and lower, you'll last
longer.
Informative post Bob. Thanks. I only wish I had your problems:)
Bob Dancer <bdancer@compdance.com> wrote: There are lots of kinds of "semi-barrings" that take place. For me at
both the MGM Grand and the Venetian, they let me continue to play but
removed about half of the slot club benefits --- i.e. holiday gift
points and all tier bonuses on cash back. And they informed me I would
no longer receive the better invitations for events. The net effect was
that I voluntarily stayed away because I no longer could play the game
at an advantage.
After I was dealt an $80,000 royal at Wynn, I was told I'd no longer get
any promotional offers (like weekly direct mail cash-back). Since the
base slot club is only worth 0.22%, that makes 9/6 Jacks unplayable
without the extra offers. Shirley also was dealt an $80,000 royal there,
but her offers continued for a little while --- until she hit enough
other royals.
Shortly after they opened, the Palms stopped sending direct mail to a
few dozen people on the G.M.'s list that he'd developed over the years
by being the G.M. elsewhere. I was included on this list --- except I
was also teaching video poker classes there at the time. I convinced
George Maloof that I would be a more effective teacher if I received the
mailers and knew what promotions were going on. He agreed and I started
receiving mailers again. They stopped classes there after another
semester or so, but I've remained welcome to play there.
Coast casinos first eliminated all discretionary comps --- and then
later they invalidated our slot club cards from getting future points.
They let us cash out the old points, however.
Sometimes casinos change their mind --- frequently because they have
changed managers. Each manager has his/her own ideas about the best way
to deal with strong players. Caesars Palace, for example, kicked out
several players, including me, but later started sending us offers
again. Now I get all of their top-tier offers.
Absolutely none of these "barrings" --- if that's what you call them ---
were done in writing. There is no way I can "prove" that any of these
things happened other than indirectly. There are players on vpFREE who
play at the MGM Grand, Mirage, Bellagio, Venetian, Wynn, Gold Coast,
Orleans, Suncoast and/or Golden Nugget who can testify that they don't
see me there during any of the promotions. The ones who know Shirley
know that she LOVES to go on cruises and that we would qualify for two
or three a year if we were eligible. I suggest reasonable people would
conclude that the main reason I don't attend promotions at the casinos
named is because I'm not invited.
It's neither fun nor profitable to be restricted. But it's inevitable if
you play big and are successful. Big royal flushes (say $40,000 and
higher, or perhaps $100,000 and higher) get the attention of casino
bosses and players who've received a lot of these irritate these bosses.
Although the timing of royals is largely luck, and the number of royals
you've hit is highly (albeit imperfectly) correlated with the number of
hours you've played, and the size of royals is directly related to the
stakes you play, many casino bosses use these royals as a barometer to
restrict players.
If you can limit your play to $5 video poker and lower, you'll last
longer. At smaller casinos, you might need to limit your play to $1 and
lower. And sometimes even lower than that.
Sometimes being "Bob Dancer" has helped my longevity at casinos and
sometimes it has hurt. If casinos are looking to crack down on skilled
players, I'm an easy one to identify because I identify myself as an
expert in a number of ways. It's impossible to read my Tuesday
casinogaming.com oolumns without concluding that I'm a knowledgeable
player. There are other players (including some that post here) who are
every bit as knowledgeable as me at the game (some more so) but who've
managed to keep a lower profile. Casino bosses have a tougher time
identifying these people as experts, so their longevity is greater.
Bob Dancer
For a 3-day free trial of Video Poker for Winners, the best video poker
computer trainer ever invented, go to //www.videopokerforwinners.com
---------------------------------
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Not true at all, but MGM Mirage is just totally obsessed with beating
you, if you win two trips in a row, you must be a professional, in
their eyes. Total joke.
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "npf15251" <npf15251@...> wrote:
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Bob Dancer" <bdancer@> wrote:
> Although the timing of royals is largely luck, and the number of
>royals you've hit is highly (albeit imperfectly) correlated with
>the number of hours you've played, and the size of royals is
>directly related to the stakes you play, many casino bosses use
>these royals as a barometer to restrict players.>If you can limit your play to $5 video poker and lower, you'll last
>longer.That wasn't my experience at all. I hit a $5 royal at the Mirage last
December and had a three-royal draw on a $1 Spin Poker machine last
April. (It is not unusual to get multiple royals on a SP machine when
you finally do get a royal).I haven't received an offer since.
Mr. Dancer responded to a post I made about being barred that the
Mirage would not be concerned about a player at my "low" level.
Therefore, it had to be some kind of a computer glitch or careless
mistake.But a follow-up conversation with my host last July confirmed indeed
that until I returned to the Mirage and showed a loss there would be
no direct mail offers issued.I haven't, they haven't, and end of story.
I repeat a post I made recently: Casinos do not like winners, and,
given identical coin-in to the break-even or losing partner beside
you, the future offers winners receive will be worse.AT ALL LEVELS.
And that's assuming, of course, that offers are even extended.
> I repeat a post I made recently: Casinos do not like winners,
and,
> given identical coin-in to the break-even or losing partner beside
> you, the future offers winners receive will be worse.
>
> AT ALL LEVELS.
You're absolutely correct. This has happened to me and my gf. We are
both $ players and Wynn gives me zilch (winner) while offering her
free rooms and free play(loser). We had identical play during an
August trip there.
Larry F.
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "paladin415x" <paladin415x@...> wrote:
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "npf15251" <npf15251@> wrote: