In a message dated 3/7/2003 12:25:14 PM Eastern Standard Time,
kellypkjoe@yahoo.com writes:
I am 69 years old and this is the first time in my life I have EVER
seen the undecided votes added to EITHER sides total to decide the
outcome. Seems kind of ...................?
My 89 year old father used to say "If you live long enough, you'll see
everything".
CF
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
My 89 year old father used to say "If you live long enough, you'll
see
everything".
CF
Do you think we'll live long enough to see France go to war [and
win]? <g>
ADR
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, Cardfather@A... wrote:
Do you think we'll live long enough to see France go to war [and
win]? <g>ADR
It is very popular right now to criticize France as if they owe us something. They don't!
If it were not for France, we would have lost the Revolutionary War. They were responsible for our winning the War of 1812. Modern myths about France don't match up to history. They fought incredibly well in World War I and stopped the Germans cold at the Marne. Several years of stalemate followed until the US brought just enough forces to shift the balance.
In World War II, the right-wing French government sold out its troops and its British allies, making peace with Hitler. But the Free French colonies continued the fight well even though commanded by the not very good general De Gaulle. The French Resistance was a large part of the reason the Allies were successful.
The French don't believe that a case has been made that Iraq is a threat. Most Europeans agree, even if many governments don't.
I am really concerned that we are permitting real threats like Al Qaeda, North Korea, Syria, Iran, China, etc. to grow while attacking a country that has never attacked the US, that is dangerous but not nearly so much as the above list, that is costing us many of our traditional allies and institutions. Apparently we are doing this because as a born-again Christian Bush really believes everything is good vs. evil and he is the Good; because he wants to avenge his Daddy ("anyway, he tried to kill my Dad", he said in an unguarded moment about why Saddam) or some combination. Let's also not forget Iraq has never attacked the US in any way, shape or form. Saddam was Daddy's client throughout the Reagan and Bush years, including when he used chemical and biological weapons against Iran and his own people without a peep of protest from the US. Nothing! No criticism, no problem. Since he was our guy!
But the French don't owe us a damned thing. I'm not sure we've paid our debt to them yet even after WWI, WWII and Diem Bien Phu. (pardon the spelling). Unlike us, they don't keep reminding us of our great debt.
Bill
Bill,
I agree with you that France has taken a lot of unnecessary criticism
but you are misleading people about the War of 1812. France had no
direct role but the threat of Napoloen did hasten the British to sign
a treaty with the United States.
Actually no one won the War of 1812. The treaty signed between the
U.S. and Great Britain merely returned the same borders to both
countries as before the War. It is popular to say that the U.S.
kicked butt in the Battle of New Orleans and won the war but the U.S.
and Great Britain signed a treaty before the battle occured. The
news from Europe (where the treaty was signed) did not arrive soon
enough to prevent the final battle in New Orleans.
News from Europe took weeks to arrive back then. It is true that we
would have never won the Revolutionary War without France. The
French blockaded the British at Yorktown and helped force their
surrender. Most of the American soldiers carried French muskets.
Look it up.
>
>Do you think we'll live long enough to see France go to war [and
>win]? <g>
>
>ADR
It is very popular right now to criticize France as if they owe us
something. They don't!If it were not for France, we would have lost the Revolutionary
War. They
were responsible for our winning the War of 1812. Modern myths
about France
don't match up to history. They fought incredibly well in World War
I and
stopped the Germans cold at the Marne. Several years of stalemate
followed
until the US brought just enough forces to shift the balance.
In World War II, the right-wing French government sold out its
troops and
its British allies, making peace with Hitler. But the Free French
colonies
continued the fight well even though commanded by the not very good
general
De Gaulle. The French Resistance was a large part of the reason the
Allies
were successful.
The French don't believe that a case has been made that Iraq is a
threat.
Most Europeans agree, even if many governments don't.
I am really concerned that we are permitting real threats like Al
Qaeda,
North Korea, Syria, Iran, China, etc. to grow while attacking a
country
that has never attacked the US, that is dangerous but not nearly so
much as
the above list, that is costing us many of our traditional allies
and
institutions. Apparently we are doing this because as a born-again
Christian Bush really believes everything is good vs. evil and he
is the
Good; because he wants to avenge his Daddy ("anyway, he tried to
kill my
Dad", he said in an unguarded moment about why Saddam) or some
combination.
Let's also not forget Iraq has never attacked the US in any way,
shape or
form. Saddam was Daddy's client throughout the Reagan and Bush
years,
including when he used chemical and biological weapons against Iran
and his
own people without a peep of protest from the US. Nothing! No
criticism, no
problem. Since he was our guy!
But the French don't owe us a damned thing. I'm not sure we've paid
our
debt to them yet even after WWI, WWII and Diem Bien Phu. (pardon
the
spelling). Unlike us, they don't keep reminding us of our great
debt.
I've got to agree with Bill on this one. We are being too hard on the
French. did you know that each and every person in the French military has
to be multi-lingual? They're required to be able to surrender in at least
10 languages.
But to keep this on topic, do you know how to tell which casinos cater to
French visitors? The ones with the Jerry Lewis vp machines.
And we can learn something from French vp players, too. When they have a
hard time deciding which is the right hold, they don't consult a strategy
card. They leave.
We gave the world craps, poker, vp, and slots. The French gave the world
Chemin de fer. How many points did you earn at Chemin de fer on your last
trip to the casino?
Charles D'Gaulle came to Las Vegas in 1953 and won $1000. Asked if he was
happy to have won he exclaimed that it was the first time any French general
since Napolean had won anything!
If not for us the French would be speaking German. But Bill is right, if
not for the French we'd all be speaking.....English.
lb