vpFREE2 Forums

re 60 minutes poker cheating

I can't say I was one bit surprised by the news about the cheating in online
poker. Involved were two areas of gambling that are almost totally
unregulated:
1. Online gambling - there is absolutely no one regulating this, making sure
you can get your money, making sure there is no cheating or badly devised
games, etc.
2. Indian Tribal Gambling - regulation falls to the tribes themselves, who
often have little knowledge of gambling, and are likely to pass their
gambling concessions on to another company, that may or may not be legitimate.

I've thought (and said) for a long time that both 1 & 2 venues were ripe
for exploitation by organized crime and/or cheaters and/or old fashioned bad
management or poorly designed computer programs/games.

It won't surprise me a bit to hear that organized crime is running some
gambling in either or both venues.

So my advice to anyone who wants to gamble - avoid venues 1 & 2 and only
play where gambling is regulated by a state or government and can be assumed to
most likely be legitimate.

But if you do gamble in either 1 or 2 - you are taking your chances of being
cheated, and that is up to you. I know thousands of people play online
poker, and many claim to be winners (or even making a living at it) - if you are
winning, good for you. But if one of these online companies ends up not
paying you your money, or massive cheating is occurring, well - you have pretty
much no recourse. Use some common sense!
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I can't say I was one bit surprised by the news about the cheating in
online
poker. Involved were two areas of gambling that are almost totally
unregulated:
1. Online gambling - there is absolutely no one regulating this, making
sure
you can get your money, making sure there is no cheating or badly
devised
games, etc.

Several of the online gambling sites are regulated, just not by the USA.

Cogno

Cogno Scienti wrote:

···

> I can't say I was one bit surprised by the news about the cheating in
> online
> poker. Involved were two areas of gambling that are almost totally
> unregulated:
> 1. Online gambling - there is absolutely no one regulating this, making
> sure
> you can get your money, making sure there is no cheating or badly
> devised
> games, etc.

Several of the online gambling sites are regulated, just not by the USA.

Cogno

========

Which ones and by whom?

_

PartyPoker, Gibraltar.
Pokerstars, Isle of Man and the less-than-impressive Kahnawake Gaming
Commission in Canada
Cake Poker, Curacao
Full Tilt, Alderny, British Channel Islands (also the questionable KGC)

···

-----Original Message-----
From: vpFREE@yahoogroups.com [mailto:vpF…@…com] On Behalf
Of MHS
Sent: Wednesday, December 3, 2008 4:17 AM
To: vpFREE@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [vpFREE] re 60 minutes poker cheating

Cogno Scienti wrote:
>
> > I can't say I was one bit surprised by the news about the cheating
in
> > online
> > poker. Involved were two areas of gambling that are almost totally
> > unregulated:
> > 1. Online gambling - there is absolutely no one regulating this,
making
> > sure
> > you can get your money, making sure there is no cheating or badly
> > devised
> > games, etc.
>
> Several of the online gambling sites are regulated, just not by the
USA.
>
> Cogno
>

========

Which ones and by whom?
>
>
> _

------------------------------------

vpFREE Links: http://members.cox.net/vpfree/Links.htm

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I used to play at Lasseter's after reading about it here on vpFREE. It is run by the Australian government but does not allow Australians to play there. Lasseter's refunded all US players funds when that damn law was passed. The UK regulates quite a few sites, check the ones based on the Isle of Man, for example. There are legal means for US citizens to deposit funds with these sites, but it is difficult and I quit trying.

···

--- On Wed, 12/3/08, MHS <mspevack@optonline.net> wrote:

From: MHS <mspevack@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [vpFREE] re 60 minutes poker cheating
To: vpFREE@yahoogroups.com
Date: Wednesday, December 3, 2008, 6:17 AM

Cogno Scienti wrote:

> I can't say I was one bit surprised by the news about the cheating in
> online
> poker. Involved were two areas of gambling that are almost totally
> unregulated:
> 1. Online gambling - there is absolutely no one regulating this, making
> sure
> you can get your money, making sure there is no cheating or badly
> devised
> games, etc.

Several of the online gambling sites are regulated, just not by the USA.

Cogno

========

Which ones and by whom?

_

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Cogno Scienti wrote:

> Several of the online gambling sites are regulated, just not by

the USA.

>
> Cogno

Which ones and by whom?
>
>
> _

Ultimate Bet and Absolute are owned by Tokwiro Enterprises. The
president of that compnay is Joe Norton, former chief of the
Kahnawake Tribe. They have a reservation up on the American Canadien
border. The Kahnawake Gaming Commission regulates Ultimate Bet,
Absolute and Full Tilt Poker. In other words you've got the fox
guarding the henhouse. And these aren't your typical foxes. The
kahnawake tribe have been implicated in everything from running guns,
drugs, cigarettes, booze to coming to an armed standoff with the
Canadien government. They blockaded a highway that runs through
their land and the Canadiens had to build a new highway around
them. This tribe has a very shady past. Just google them if you
want to see how bad it is.

···

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, MHS <mspevack@...> wrote:

I forgot to mention--the servers for Ultimate Bet, Absolute and Full
Tilt Poker are on Kahnawake tribal land.

>
> Cogno Scienti wrote:

> > Several of the online gambling sites are regulated, just not by
the USA.
> >
> > Cogno
>
>
> Which ones and by whom?
> >
> >
> > _
>
Ultimate Bet and Absolute are owned by Tokwiro Enterprises. The
president of that compnay is Joe Norton, former chief of the
Kahnawake Tribe. They have a reservation up on the American

Canadien

border. The Kahnawake Gaming Commission regulates Ultimate Bet,
Absolute and Full Tilt Poker. In other words you've got the fox
guarding the henhouse. And these aren't your typical foxes. The
kahnawake tribe have been implicated in everything from running

guns,

···

drugs, cigarettes, booze to coming to an armed standoff with the
Canadien government. They blockaded a highway that runs through
their land and the Canadiens had to build a new highway around
them. This tribe has a very shady past. Just google them if you
want to see how bad it is.

Most sites accept Western Union and/or Moneygram. Pretty simple when
using Moneygram at any Wal Mart store throughout the US. I don't play
online poker anymore but I've been known to make a sports wager at
offshore books a time or three.

···

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, Joe Pucek <pucekjoe@...> wrote:

There are legal means for US citizens to deposit funds with these
sites, but it is difficult and I quit trying.

PokerStars and Moneygram parted company a few months ago.

···

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "hockeystl" <vegasstl@...> wrote:

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, Joe Pucek <pucekjoe@> wrote:
>
> There are legal means for US citizens to deposit funds with these
>sites, but it is difficult and I quit trying.

Most sites accept Western Union and/or Moneygram. Pretty simple when
using Moneygram at any Wal Mart store throughout the US. I don't play
online poker anymore but I've been known to make a sports wager at
offshore books a time or three.