For those of you who
have trouble reading fine
print, there have been a
couple of changes
regarding the April
drawing at the Palms.
Rule #15 states in
part "Entries will not be
earned on 100%, full Pay
and Not so Ugly
Dueces.
Also while players
must be present at each
drawing there will be no
redraws for unclaimed
prizes at that drawing. In
the past either one had
24hrs in which to claim or
additional tickets were
drawn until all prizes
were claimed.
Steve N.
Palm's Drawing Rule Changes
Memo to George Maloof: George, my man, don't you have better things to
do, like chasing Playboy-quality tail like your brothers do, than
worry about people pounding away on the Deuces? I have written in
these fora at least half a dozen times as to what an overplayed promo
this is-you should thank your lucky stars that otherwise intelligent
people can't do the math on this one. If I were in your shoes, I would
welcome the action, and be like your brothers and focus on which
Playmate I have the best chance of getting the panties to drop with.
Whoever thought these rules up should be put out to pasture and out of
their misery like the cheap claimer of a slot or promotions director
that they obviously are.
Dude, this is totally stupid. Meta-stupid. Mega-stupid. As one friend
of mine is fond of saying, Blazing Mid-Day Sun On Mercury Hot Stupid.
Capisce?
···
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "srnvp" <steveinnv@...> wrote:
For those of you who
have trouble reading fine
print, there have been a
couple of changes
regarding the April
drawing at the Palms.
Rule #15 states in
part "Entries will not be
earned on 100%, full Pay
and Not so Ugly
Dueces.
Also while players
must be present at each
drawing there will be no
redraws for unclaimed
prizes at that drawing. In
the past either one had
24hrs in which to claim or
additional tickets were
drawn until all prizes
were claimed.
Steve N.
_______________________________________________________________________
Paladin wrote an open memo (rant, actually) to George Maloof, managing
owner of the Palms. The gist of the rant was that since Paladin
considers playing NSU to get Palms drawing tickets a bad play for
intelligent gamblers, Maloof is foolish to restrict these machines from
the current promotion.
I think Paladin's argument is off base. First, many players
don't agree with Paladin's analysis of the value of the promotions.
There are several strong players (including me) who believe it is a
decent play. Maloof probably doesn't know for sure. When Maloof sees a
number of strong pros hammering NSU to get tickets, and gets a memo from
somebody he doesn't know saying the pros have their heads up their &*^%,
Maloof must come to the conclusion that many strong players think they
have the advantage, even if there are minority opinions out there. It is
easy for him to conclude that if the pros think they have the advantage,
it's possible they are smarter about it than he is.
Second, even if you grant Paladin's argument that the rest of
the pros have totally figured it wrong, the fact remains that the Palms
loses money on the best of these pros. Casinos don't make much when they
have a 99.73% game and give 0.125% "cash back" (free play, actually) to
players who play in High Limits. These players get monthly mailers
(including up to $450 monthly cash, $150 monthly worth of meals, $50
worth of spa treatment, plus other things) plus comps from the hosts.
Whether Paladin evaluates these comps as being worth it to him or not,
George Maloof will tell him that they are costly for him to give away.
Paladin might be counting $150 worth of food as worthless (due to the
fact that he has food comps "everywhere"), but worthless to Paladin
doesn't mean it is costless to the casino. Comping rooms (which Paladin
might be evaluating as worth zero) when it could be selling them at $200
a night or more is VERY costly to a casino. If you include all costs,
the Palms does NOT make money on NSU.
Third, Maloof wants to encourage play among players of lesser
games --- primarily slot players. There is a group of players (again,
including me at some drawings) who play large sums at NSU who are
disproportionate winners of the drawings. Slot players notice that the
same people keep winning over and over again. Maloof is much better off
if he can discourage NSU play which has the effect of making it more
likely for slot players (a REAL profit center) to win. If he ends up
getting slot players to play more because their chances have improved,
he is quite a bit ahead.
Finally, having nothing to do with Paladin's argument, I don't
know how this particular promotion will play out. The NSU games at the
Palms are on multi-game machines that include 9/6 DDB, 8/5 Bonus, 9/6
Triple DB, etc. These games are all MUCH tighter than NSU. The player
tracking system at the Palms tracks by MACHINE, not by game. They can't
exclude NSU without excluding several other games they do NOT want to
exclude. I suspect that NSU WILL BE INCLUDED in these drawings, printed
rules stating otherwise notwithstanding.
I'm not playing there this week as I'm going to be in Detroit
during this weekend's drawing so I'll be playing later in the month
where my play gets added benefits. But several people ARE playing this
week, and you can see by swiping your card whether you are earning
drawing tickets or not. Perhaps Jean or someone can post here whether or
not she earned tickets playing NSU this week.
Bob Dancer
For the best in video poker information, visit www.bobdancer.com
or call 1-800-244-2224 M-F 9-5 Pacific Time.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Bob Dancer <bob.dancer@compdance.com> wrote: The player tracking system at the Palms tracks by MACHINE, not by game. They can't exclude NSU without excluding several other games they do NOT want to exclude. I suspect that NSU WILL BE INCLUDED in these drawings, printed rules stating otherwise notwithstanding.
Good point, Bob. I played 8/5 BP instead of NSU because of the stated rules, but still wondered if the machine would be excluded since it contains NSU. I didn't think of trying to play NSU and then swiping my card to see if I got entries; that's the smart thing to do.
I found it humorous that the printed rules flyer actually refers to "Not So Ugly Deuces"....lol. Even though that's how we players have come to refer to it, for a casino to actually call it that seems funny. "Hey, would you like to try our most popular game, 'Not So Ugly Deuces'?" 
That's like, "Would you like to date my Not So Ugly daughter?" hee hee
vp
···
---------------------------------
Talk is cheap. Use Yahoo! Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls. Great rates starting at 1¢/min.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Bob Dancer <bob.dancer@compdance.com> wrote: <<The player tracking system at the Palms tracks by MACHINE, not by game.>>
I talked to one knowledgeable person in the slot club and she said that they were working on tracking by game. She thought it had already been done. Looks like, by the stickers, this has not been implemented yet. I wonder if their tracking system can even be made to do this???
<<Perhaps Jean or someone can post here whether or
not she earned tickets playing NSU this week.>>
I am not playing until later in the month - so some one else will have to do the testing.
···
________________________________________
Jean $�ott - http://www.FrugalGambler.biz
Tax time is coming up - groan! "Tax Help
for the Frugal Gambler" can answer many
of your questions!
16, Chet..)
The tickets, at best, playing NSU, are worth .05. A high limit
player must generate $100 coin in to receive one ticket. To calculate
the value of the ticket, you need to divide the amount given away at
each drawing, which is usually $10,000, by the total number of
tickets, which are usually about 200,000. When one divides $10K/200K,
one comes up with .05. To receive that ticket which is worth .05, one
must give up 27 cents in EV. Now, I concede there are other factors,
such as playing in high limit, which means you're now giving up 14.5
cents if you take the freeplay instead of the comps. As for the
bounceback, let's say you're running through 900K/month, as some do.
The bounceback is worth .05, or $450/900,000. Assuming NO mistakes,
and NO tips (I would factor in .01 for each, even you), and taking
your comps in free play, we're at 99.728 +.0125 +.05 + .05, which is
99.953.
I am surprised that you would include non-liquid comp value in your
analysis. TRUE APs look at plays industrially; i.e., what is the
bottom line? Either the play is profitable or it's not. Local LV plays
require a slightly different formulation, true, but again, comps are
not assessed EV unless you can assign a liquid value to them.
Moreover, assigning a spa comp to an EV formulation only buttresses my
point about all of this.
Finally, casinos are valued by the hold, but they are also valued by
the drop. The extra action put in by all skilled NSU players, only
adds to the valuation of the Palms, which creates benefits for them in
many ways. I assure you the Maloofs understand this basic concept.
Assuming they are holding stated theo of .67% on the game, they're
still making money, but more importantly, creating value for the
property.
While we're one the subject of the Maloofs, one e-mail I received
asked me not to be so deragatory of them. Actually, quite the opposite
is true. Anyone who can pull off owning both a casino and an NBA team
has idol status, IMHO. They even have out Hef'd Hefner, their own idol.
I am a little curious about something. As Bob wrote last year in
Strictly Slots, Bob has access to Palms ownership. Now, to be fair,
Bob plays very heavily over there and the Maloofs make a point to
personally establish relationships with their best and most loyal
customers. Doesn't the reader find it ironic that Bob is taking the
house POV on this, where, again, IMHO (ok, it's not so humble) I've
demonstrated that it's clearly not profitable for a player to play for
drawing tickets on the machines in question?
Now of course, if the 15-11 NSUD goes in (and trust me, Bob isn't
writing about it unless he has a deal in place, or close to it,
somewhere), then you have the answer to your questions. Stay tuned.
···
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Bob Dancer" <bob.dancer@...> wrote:
Paladin wrote an open memo (rant, actually) to George Maloof, managing
owner of the Palms. The gist of the rant was that since Paladin
considers playing NSU to get Palms drawing tickets a bad play for
intelligent gamblers, Maloof is foolish to restrict these machines from
the current promotion.I think Paladin's argument is off base....(over to you on
________________________________________________________________________
See you at Ghostbar.