vpFREE2 Forums

Okay you math wizards, let's consider this ...

#1

After watching a bit about the London Club in the Aladdin, I thought
I'd come here and pose a 'What If ...' question to those enlightened
mathematicians.

I believe it quite possible, as I don't recall where I read/saw that
Bob Dancer made over 1M last year in VP, much due to his $100K RF
followed shortly after by his wife's $400K RF for a tidy $500K in one
evening! Talk about a great night, eh?

But let's have a serious look at if this is still possible and what
would be required to earn a significant living in a year's time on
VP. Obviously Bob has done this, and of course, we'd love to hear
from him.

Let's assume that Bankroll will NOT be a problem, though could
someone run the Risk of Ruin Bankroll requirements for High Limit VP
machines? It would not be fun to already HAVE to be a Millionaire in
order to undertake the possibility of winning a $1M / year income! :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye:

I'm guessing, and I'd sure like to hear from folks in the know, that
the max High Limit VP available at The London Club would be $100
coin, with $500 Max Bet. Assuming a RF would pay 4000 coins, hence
$400K for an RF win, which I'm guess is what Mrs. Dancer won.

What VP would be available at that level of play? Anything near/over
100% or are the casinos unwilling to risk it, even on a highly
volatile game?

What sort of comps would you think would be available for this level
of play? Are they spartan, considering anyone who'd play that level
would have to be an advantaged player?

What sort of Coin-In would one generate in a typical session; noting
that Bob Dancer mentioned that his play is often 8 or more brutal
hours a day! (It's a living?!) :wink:

Obviously, Bob HAS done it, though I'd really like to know what level
he was playing on to reach his $1M / year earnings.

This is truly one of the smartest and brightests groups of
individuals I've come to know, and I can only wonder that if given
the proper bankroll, temperment, tenacity and of course access to the
right games, could someone really make a GREAT living as a High Limit
VP player TODAY?

Please let me know ... though I lack ALL of the above, I'm very
curious as to the possibilities that remain with so many casinos
cutting back on the perks and priviliges of the advantaged VP player.

Many thanks!

#2

I believe it quite possible, as I don't recall where I read/saw

that

Bob Dancer made over 1M last year in VP, much due to his $100K

RF

followed shortly after by his wife's $400K RF for a tidy $500K

in one

evening! Talk about a great night, eh?

The London Club would be $100 coin, with $500 Max Bet.
Assuming a RF would pay 4000 coins, hence $400K for an RF win,
which I'm guess is what Mrs. Dancer won.

What sort of Coin-In would one generate in a typical session;

noting

that Bob Dancer mentioned that his play is often 8 or more

brutal

hours a day! (It's a living?!) :wink:

It only takes $625 coin-in to WIN the $500K, but to EARN (generate
and expected profit of) that amount takes a LOT more. BD was
playing with
a razor thing edge. He had would require roughly 500 * .5M, or
about $250M
to expect a profit of $500K. And that estimate is counting some
of the
intagible benefits (shopping $$ at year end, airline freq. flier
mileage, etc)
at nearly full value.

Obviously, Bob HAS done it, though I'd really like to know what

level

he was playing on to reach his $1M / year earnings.

You misspelled 'winnings'. He would have had to play 800,000
hands
on the $25 5-play JOB to EARN that $1M. That would require about
25 weeks of full time play at 800 hands/hr. Considering how many
handpays are required, it would be very hard to play that quickly.

#3

Dancer has an upcoming book discussing how he made the
million.

I think reading the book would answer some but not all
of your questions.

···

__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now.
http://mailplus.yahoo.com

#4

Gambl00ers touches on some of the salient points relevent to this
question. Here are some more.

Bob/Shirley were unlikely to be bankrolled for that $100 play. He
himself terms it "taking a shot". The EV on their play for the year
was likely substantially short of the $1M that you question as an
annual target.

Even if you were to question whether a $100K annual EV is possible,
the answer is not very likely. It's dependent upon very strong
promotional opportunities at relatively high play denominations. Bob
may very well have ridden the crest of these. Several casinos have
"backed off" Bob and other high-limit advantage players because of
extraordinary wins that have taken a toll on the monthly bottom line.
Promotions similar to what they have played are likely to be more
restricted. And promotions are the key to high earnings potential
since standard plays and base cashback certainly aren't sufficient.

That's not to say that excellent opportunities don't/won't arise from
time to time for the $1+ player. But they can hardly be relied upon
and as the universe of players becomes more those opportunities are
likely to become increasingly rare.

Bottom line: Don't give up that day job. All the same, keep your
eyes open and do your best not to kill the excellent plays when the
opportunity arises.

- Harry

Marc wrote:

···

I believe it quite possible, as I don't recall where I read/saw that
Bob Dancer made over 1M last year in VP, much due to his $100K RF
followed shortly after by his wife's $400K RF for a tidy $500K in one
evening! Talk about a great night, eh?

But let's have a serious look at if this is still possible and what
would be required to earn a significant living in a year's time on
VP. Obviously Bob has done this, and of course, we'd love to hear
from him.

Obviously, Bob HAS done it, though I'd really like to know what level
he was playing on to reach his $1M / year earnings.

#5

--- In vpFREE@y..., "Marc" <cetacea@m...> wrote:

But let's have a serious look at if this is still possible and what
would be required to earn a significant living in a year's time on
VP. Obviously Bob has done this, and of course, we'd love to hear
from him.

I'd love to hear his input on this as well, but am expecting the
answer to be "read the new book". My guess is that they are making
money at VP, but making a LIVING selling strategy cards, books,
Winpoker, etc.

#6

From everything that I have heard, he plays at a razor thin advantage,
so small, that one error could wipe out the entire advantage.

···

On Sat, 30 Nov 2002 17:01:41 -0000, you wrote:

--- In vpFREE@y..., "Marc" <cetacea@m...> wrote:

But let's have a serious look at if this is still possible and what
would be required to earn a significant living in a year's time on
VP. Obviously Bob has done this, and of course, we'd love to hear
from him.

I'd love to hear his input on this as well, but am expecting the
answer to be "read the new book". My guess is that they are making
money at VP, but making a LIVING selling strategy cards, books,
Winpoker, etc.

vpFREE Home Page:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vpFREE

vpFREE Links:
http://www.lvcm.com/tomesims/VP/Links.html

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/