My Response/Rant/Lesson

[Bob_Dancer1]

Paladin continued with his anti-Dancer remarks. Go back and see the
earlier post if you like, but quoting it in its entirety is too long.

Paladin continues to repeat that I identify advantage players to casino
management. It's an easy charge to make, and has been repeated by others
who are not Dancer fans, but it's simply not true. That's not part of my
M.O.

Paladin criticizes me for not telling everything about why I play at the
Palms. I find this curious. First of all, I DO write about the Palms
quite a bit. My second novel, "More Sex, Lies, and Video Poker," has as
it main characters two strong players who discuss at length how they
evaluate various features of the Palms program. That book clearly goes
far more into the whys of Palms VP (for moderate to high rollers) than
any other source. Secondly, and more important, the main thrust of his
website rant was that I told TOO MUCH about Caesars (although I didn't
talk about "theoretical," which was his major complaint). This is a guy
who wants to criticize me if I say too little or if I say too much. It's
impossible to please someone like that.

He suggests that changes at the Palms on games that I don't play, don't
write about, and certainly don't consult with the Palms about, are
somehow all my fault. He suggests that I'm good buddies with George
Maloof and George listens to me about what to do in his casino. While
I've known Maloof for several years (my first teaching gig was at the
Fiesta in 1997 where Maloof was the managing partner), the only
substantive conversations I've had with Maloof in the past three years
have been about my second novel. I did have one conversation with his GM
(Jim Hughes) shortly after they removed NSU from all of the machines
last year and I suggested that that was a mistake. They ended up putting
them back. I've had several five- or ten-minute conversations with the
slot director (Don Hallmark) about a wide variety of subjects, but Don
is a manager who walks the floor a lot and talks with a variety of
players --- including me.

In his web article he suggests that my footprints are behind every
casino who removes good games or promotions. In 2006, we saw that at
Barbary Coast, Gold Coast, Orleans, Suncoast, South Coast/Point, Golden
Nugget, Monte Lago, Rio, Bally's, Paris, Flamingo, Caesars, Harrah's,
Tuscany, Cannery, both Fiestas, and probably some more that I've
omitted. I understand his argument that I had an effect on the Caesars
changes (and I doubt that my actions had any such effect), but it
boggles the mind how he can argue how I had an effect on ANY of the
other changes, let alone all of them.

In his web article he suggests that every place I've taught at gets
worse video poker. Certainly both Fiestas added numerous new games on
the Bob Dancer machines while I was there. When they decided they didn't
want those machines/classes, I was terminated and the machines came down
and they've made numerous tightenings since then. How are any of those
tightenings my fault? At the Silverton, the games on the Bob Dancer
Approved machines are considerably looser than others in the casino. I
only teach at casinos with better-than-average video poker. I teach at
Greektown in Detroit (clearly the top vp in the area), the Borgata in AC
(which had far more 9/6 Jacks than anyone else in town when I started
teaching there. Now the game is more plentiful all over town.) I also
teach at Barona near San Diego (next class April 21), which certainly
has competitive video poker. None of these casinos also use me for
consulting purposes.

It seems obvious that Paladin doesn't like me. The best I can hope for
is that he eventually chooses to vent his ire on other topics.

Bob Dancer

For a 3-day free trial of Video Poker for Winners, the best video poker
computer trainer ever invented, go to //www.videopokerforwinners.com

[Jean]

<<Paladin continues to repeat that I identify advantage players to casino
management. It's an easy charge to make, and has been repeated by others
who are not Dancer fans, but it's simply not true. That's not part of my
M.O.>>

I would have to respectfully disagree. You pointed me out to a Venetian executive and discussed who I "really" was, back when I was not so well-known, and when I asked why you would do that, you said you didn't think it mattered. I thought it mattered a lot.

···

________________________________________
Jean $¢ott - "FRUGAL VIDEO POKER"
This new book (autographed) and other
   frugal products are now available at my
   new Web site, http://queenofcomps.com/.
   E-mail address is queenofcomps@cox.net.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Cogno_Scienti]

Bob Dancer:

<<Paladin continues to repeat that I identify advantage players to casino
management. It's an easy charge to make, and has been repeated by others who
are not Dancer fans, but it's simply not true. That's not part of my M.O.>>

I have no knowledge one way or the other on that charge. However, your
publishing articles in the trade press about how to defeat advantage players
is unforgivable.

Cogno

[WP_SF]

Bob Dancer:

<<Paladin continues to repeat that I identify advantage players to

casino

management. It's an easy charge to make, and has been repeated by

others who

are not Dancer fans, but it's simply not true. That's not part of my

M.O.>>

I have no knowledge one way or the other on that charge. However, your
publishing articles in the trade press about how to defeat advantage

players

is unforgivable.

A friend of mine is a world-class table games talent. One of his
claims to fame is that he was trespassed from the Palms, and he wasn't
even playing. I take that as a supreme compliment, if the Maloofs
don't even want him in the building. The friend made the accusation
several years ago, and this is a guy I'd trust watching my children.

The second was a recent e-mail from a member of paladingaming.net, and
involved a tribal casino in the Upper Midwest. I am aware of enough
bits and pieces of the story to think there might be something to it.
I knew of the play for many years, but the area was too remote, and
the weather too cold (like winter 9 months of the year) to make a play
there. This was a place Dancer had been hired to speak at, and gave it
some publicity in one of his columns.

Now, this is something you might want to consider. Knowing this, would
you want to give your name to IGT's marketing when buying VPFW (a work
in progress, IMHO, but not without enormous potential) online? Without
making any judgments here, I'd be much more comfortable buying it at
LVA, or from GBC.

···

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Cogno Scienti" <cognoscienti@...> wrote:

______________________________________________________________________

paladingaming.net

[WP_SF]

(mercifully snipped)

I posted something early this am, then thought better of it and
deleted the post. I understand some of you get VPFree through a
newsreader, and it comes through as the message is posted.

I've posted a brief response here:
http://paladingaming.net/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=45&Itemid=1

and hopefully that will be it.

I will add something here. Even though my opinion of Bob hasn't
changed too much over the years, I thought it was wrong for MGM to
boycott Casino Player after they backed him off. The idea was to get
him fired. As bad as it was to let him play, and I'm sure a few execs
got canned over that, it was exponentially worse to withhold
advertising from CP-that one was a total lose/lose for MGM and CP.
Whoever came up with the bright idea should have had his or her empty
suit ass summarily, as a talking clown once mused, so fired.

I have no problem with him publishing; yes it would be hypocritical
for me to assert this; I have always said he is an excellent technical
writer. Winpoker, which he promoted, is still a superior product. But
he does have access to the Maloofs, that much is clear, and who comes
up with these cuckoo rules for the promos? Certainly not marketing,
and absolutely not slot ops. I think their marketing director only
returns calls at gunpoint, and I'm not even sure of that. Only at the
Palms would a $2 5-line player be considered a flea.

···

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Bob Dancer" <bob.dancer@...> wrote:

Paladin continued with his anti-Dancer remarks. Go back and see the
earlier post if you like, but quoting it in its entirety is too long.

________________________________________________________________________

[eric_testori]

Bob Dancer wrote:Paladin continues to repeat that I identify advantage players to casino management,but its simply not true.
   
  Ive been a advantage player since 1998, Bob Dancer came to my local casino(Turtle Creek Casino traverse city, Michigan)in 2003 to teach some vp classes and host a video poker tourny(and to sell his wares)I was excited to hear he was going to be coming to my local casino because I had read alot of his material and thought it would be fun to talk with him and share some stories. For this vp touny you had to qualify to make the quarter finals then qualify again to make the finals it was a strange format 1hour long sessions(great for me I play very fast)well The first session I played bob was there and my host introduced me to him we spoke for about 5min and I told him alittle about my self and some of the good opportunites I had found in the area.Bob told me about his new book and wished me good luck as my round was about to start.As I took my seat I noticed Bob walking up to the slot manager and having a conversation with him.I was lucky enough go on to win the
tounament(40,000 first place)A week later I was playing golf with the casino manager(I had become freinds with many of the employes at the casino)and He told me that "bob dancer told his slot manager that with a guy like me in there backyard they were in trouble"We kind of laughed about it(my image was that of a high roller)I was furious All I could think about was how could someone who teaches people how to win at the casino turn some one in for winning at the casino.A few weeks later I won a couple prizes at one of there promotions and They took my players card away and said I could no longer participate in anymore promotions at the casino.
   
  Eric T.

···

Bob Dancer <bob.dancer@compdance.com> wrote:
          Paladin continued with his anti-Dancer remarks. Go back and see the
earlier post if you like, but quoting it in its entirety is too long.

Paladin continues to repeat that I identify advantage players to casino
management. It's an easy charge to make, and has been repeated by others
who are not Dancer fans, but it's simply not true. That's not part of my
M.O.

Paladin criticizes me for not telling everything about why I play at the
Palms. I find this curious. First of all, I DO write about the Palms
quite a bit. My second novel, "More Sex, Lies, and Video Poker," has as
it main characters two strong players who discuss at length how they
evaluate various features of the Palms program. That book clearly goes
far more into the whys of Palms VP (for moderate to high rollers) than
any other source. Secondly, and more important, the main thrust of his
website rant was that I told TOO MUCH about Caesars (although I didn't
talk about "theoretical," which was his major complaint). This is a guy
who wants to criticize me if I say too little or if I say too much. It's
impossible to please someone like that.

He suggests that changes at the Palms on games that I don't play, don't
write about, and certainly don't consult with the Palms about, are
somehow all my fault. He suggests that I'm good buddies with George
Maloof and George listens to me about what to do in his casino. While
I've known Maloof for several years (my first teaching gig was at the
Fiesta in 1997 where Maloof was the managing partner), the only
substantive conversations I've had with Maloof in the past three years
have been about my second novel. I did have one conversation with his GM
(Jim Hughes) shortly after they removed NSU from all of the machines
last year and I suggested that that was a mistake. They ended up putting
them back. I've had several five- or ten-minute conversations with the
slot director (Don Hallmark) about a wide variety of subjects, but Don
is a manager who walks the floor a lot and talks with a variety of
players --- including me.

In his web article he suggests that my footprints are behind every
casino who removes good games or promotions. In 2006, we saw that at
Barbary Coast, Gold Coast, Orleans, Suncoast, South Coast/Point, Golden
Nugget, Monte Lago, Rio, Bally's, Paris, Flamingo, Caesars, Harrah's,
Tuscany, Cannery, both Fiestas, and probably some more that I've
omitted. I understand his argument that I had an effect on the Caesars
changes (and I doubt that my actions had any such effect), but it
boggles the mind how he can argue how I had an effect on ANY of the
other changes, let alone all of them.

In his web article he suggests that every place I've taught at gets
worse video poker. Certainly both Fiestas added numerous new games on
the Bob Dancer machines while I was there. When they decided they didn't
want those machines/classes, I was terminated and the machines came down
and they've made numerous tightenings since then. How are any of those
tightenings my fault? At the Silverton, the games on the Bob Dancer
Approved machines are considerably looser than others in the casino. I
only teach at casinos with better-than-average video poker. I teach at
Greektown in Detroit (clearly the top vp in the area), the Borgata in AC
(which had far more 9/6 Jacks than anyone else in town when I started
teaching there. Now the game is more plentiful all over town.) I also
teach at Barona near San Diego (next class April 21), which certainly
has competitive video poker. None of these casinos also use me for
consulting purposes.

It seems obvious that Paladin doesn't like me. The best I can hope for
is that he eventually chooses to vent his ire on other topics.

Bob Dancer

For a 3-day free trial of Video Poker for Winners, the best video poker
computer trainer ever invented, go to //www.videopokerforwinners.com

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Harry_Porter]

eric testori wrote:

I've been a advantage player since 1998, Bob Dancer came to my local
casino(Turtle Creek Casino traverse city, Michigan)in 2003 to teach
some vp classes and host a video poker tourny(and to sell his wares)
... For this vp touny you had to qualify to make the quarter finals
then qualify again to make the finals it was a strange format 1hour
long sessions(great for me I play very fast)well The first session I
played bob was there and my host introduced me to him we spoke for
about 5min and I told him alittle about my self and some of the good
opportunites I had found in the area. As I took my seat I noticed Bob
walking up to the slot manager and having a conversation with him. I
was lucky enough go on to win the tounament(40,000 first place)
A week later I was playing golf with the casino manager(I had become
freinds with many of the employes at the casino)and He told me that
"bob dancer told his slot manager that with a guy like me in there
backyard they were in trouble"We kind of laughed about it(my image
was that of a high roller)I was furious All I could think about was
how could someone who teaches people how to win at the casino turn
some one in for winning at the casino.A few weeks later I won a
couple prizes at one of there promotions and They took my players
card away and said I could no longer participate in anymore
promotions at the casino.

My guess is that any remark by Bob was incidental to his introduction
to you and hardly intended to "out" you as a threat to the casino.
But it wouldn't surprise me if Turtle Creek was running a good case of
"advantage player" phobia at that time.

I expect that coincident with Bob's first visit that they gave
"Million Dollar Video Poker" (recently published) a good thumbing.
While Bob's regaling therein of his MGM experience should be a
balanced cautionary tale to any casino in how they might best manage
their skilled player base, I've imagined that in many quarters it
simply elicited a knee jerk response.

I'm sure you recognize that the tournament format was as effective at
singling your play out for attention as anything might be. Amongst a
relatively laid back group of players, your banging away at a machine
non-stop for an hour at what I expect was upwards of 1200 hph
certainly set you apart.

That combined with your tournament win certainly might be expected to
prompt a peak at your overall profitability to the casino. Whether
through skill or luck, you lend a clear impression that you had the
upper hand at Turtle Creek.

So, when you turn around a short time later and pull down a couple of
drawing prizes, you've managed in short order to feed all of the
appetites a paranoid psyche might manifest. No casino savors the
feeling that promotions intended to encourage/reward it's profitiable
player base are being siphoned off by an unprofitable element.

···

-------

What Bob may or may not have said is merely speculation. I simply
suggest that it wouldn't take his specific intervention for the
consequences you suffered to be conceivable and quite possibly likely.

- Harry

[caplatinum]

If you accept the story at face value, there is no question Dancer
outed this person. If in fact, the casino manager told this player
that Dancer said something specific about this player and their
abilities, that is an outing - what the casino did or did not decide
to do it about, may be their own decision, but why is Dancer
flagging players? There has been some sharp criticism of Dancer on
another gaming site for "outing" players. Some people criticize his
consulting business and believe he plays both sides of the street. I
have actually argued this is OK, depending on what he is selling.

If some casino wants to hire him, to caclulate the odds on a new
game or value a promotion, I think that is fine. If a casino wants
to even hire him to figure out how to offer loose games without
losing their shirts, that is also fine. I would argue the latter
helps knowledgable players because if the casinos cannot figure out
a resposnible way to offer loose games and the promos that go with
them and it is usually the cashback, bounceback or promos that make
the game a loser for the casino, not the game itself - then they
will tighten all the games and run us all off. Others have a
different feeling about Dancer and anyone who has a relationship
with the casinos as working with the "dark side".

My general feeling is that even if Bob is kind of a mixed bag,
because he "helps" the casinos, I think on balance players have been
better off with him than without him. Certainly, his articles and
products and classes have allowed people to play much better than
many otherwise would have. I know one major Strip casino slot
manager that believes Dancer single handily destroyed the
profitability of video poker - so the casinos don't consider him
their friend either.

Where I draw the line is the outing of players - that would make Bob
a spy who could not be trusted. Imagine, you go to his classes, read
his articles, buy his software and then you happen to have a
conversation with him in a casino and he sees that you have learned
what he taught and he points you at to the casino and says, " see
her, she is now 85% as good as I am, if you don't want me here, you
probably don't want her here either".

Nobody likes a rat.

[caplatinum]

[Jean]

Harry Porter said: "My guess is that any remark by Bob was incidental to his introduction
to you and hardly intended to "out" you as a threat to the casino."

Harry, you are my friend, but guessing doesn't have any validity here. How do you know Bob's intentions? Have you ever had Bob mention your name to a casino executive? Have you ever had a personal acquaintance with Bob? Have you ever been the victim of one of his dirty business deals, like the ones he brags about in "Million Dollar VP," one that cost you a lot of money.

It is true that many factors may have contributed to the barring of this player (that is not the issue here, Harry), but there is NEVER any excuse for Bob to mention one person by name and give any indication of his/her skill level, even as an off-hand remark. He can tell us until he is blue in the face that he does not "out" players. I believe he means he doesn't draw up lists of AP players and give to the casinos. But I know he doesn't "count" off-hand remarks that are just as damaging to the individual involved because he has told me this. And I happen to know, from my own experience and from the reports of other reliable sources, that these remarks are being made.

···

________________________________________
Jean $¢ott - "FRUGAL VIDEO POKER"
This new book (autographed) and other
   frugal products are now available at my
   new Web site, http://queenofcomps.com/.
   E-mail address is queenofcomps@cox.net.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Bob_Dancer1]

Eric wrote: A week later I was playing golf with the casino manager(I
had become freinds with many of the employes at the casino)and He told
me that "bob dancer told his slot manager that with a guy like me in
there backyard they were in trouble"

I remember Eric. No matter what the casino manager told him, I never had
a conversation like that with the slot director.

Bob Dancer

For a 3-day free trial of Video Poker for Winners, the best video poker
computer trainer ever invented, go to //www.videopokerforwinners.com

[Bob_Dancer1]

Jean said: I would have to respectfully disagree. You pointed me out to
a Venetian executive and discussed who I "really" was, back when I was
not so well-known, and when I asked why you would do that, you said you
didn't think it mattered. I thought it mattered a lot.

Jean, your sharing this incident with others might be the source of many
people believing that I identify advantage players. Unfortunately what
you are sharing isn't what occurred.

That incident happened in either late 2000 or early 2001. The way, Jean,
that it went down was as follows: One manager (D. C. Graham, VP of
marketing) was reacting to my pseudonym. He brought up your real name
and asked me if I knew you wrote under the name of "Jean Scott". I told
him I knew who you were. (I don't remember is this was before or after
your "Frugal Gambler" book. But he knew you wrote somewhere.) He asked
if you were a video poker expert. I laughed and told them that neither
you nor Brad were particularly strong players, and that you neither
played for high stakes nor long hours. That was the entire conversation.
(I informed you of it later as a courtesy. I certainly didn't "out" you
in any respect. D. C. brought your name up. I still don't think that
conversation mattered a lot. If anything, I improved the chances of you
remaining welcome there.) D. C. came to the reasonable decision that you
and Brad were "small fry" not worth worrying about. The Venetian
restricted me there shortly thereafter. My "sin" was being significantly
ahead primarily because of being dealt a $5 Five Play royal and
Shirley's was also for getting too many royals.

It would surprise me a lot, Jean, if any casino 86'd you for being too
good although it is possible that you could be over-royaled somewhere
and a casino manager over-reacted to that. (That could happen to anyone
and has sometimes happened to very weak players.) I'm not a fan of
yours, but I'm not going around ruining your welcome with casinos. Never
have. Never will. And even if I WERE to identify strong players (which I
don't), Jean, your name would not be in the top 200.

Bob Dancer

For a 3-day free trial of Video Poker for Winners, the best video poker
computer trainer ever invented, go to //www.videopokerforwinners.com

[john_blutarski]

.....I laughed and told them that neither
you nor Brad were particularly strong players, and that you neither
played for high stakes nor long hours.

.....

...It would surprise me a lot, Jean, if any casino 86'd you for

being too

good although it is possible that you could be over-royaled somewhere
and a casino manager over-reacted to that. (That could happen to anyone
and has sometimes happened to very weak players.)

.....
And even if I WERE to identify strong players (which I

don't), Jean, your name would not be in the top 200.

Bob Dancer

You're a real class act, Bob.

···

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Bob Dancer" <bob.dancer@...> wrote:

[caplatinum]

-Bob,

Leaving aside some of the people here who are either competitors or
have some personal anomousity towards you - there have been posts on
other sites most notably stanford wong's BJ21 about you outing
players. One of them from a real AP that has no stake or favorite in
the Dancer/Scott/Paymar battles, but simply wants to make money. He
says he knows people you have outed. Generally, I have been
defensive of you on Bj21 and in some private e-mails with these
people, because the nature of this it is full of innuednudo and half-
truths and the blow up on the Caesars matter was a kind of good
example of event sequencing where perhaps you were blamed for
something you had nothing to do with. And though you don't know me
from this handle, the few times we have seen each other in a casino,
you were always helpful if I had a question - so I tend to give you
the benefit of the doubt.

But even I am suspicious of your relationships at the Palms - why
would they let you play there and not others they have deemed as
skilled or promo restricted some people, but not you? The Palms
seems to view you as a cost of doing business. Why is that? What do
you do for them, that gives you a pass that others cannot get? The
Palms is very sweaty on the BJ games, so why would they let one of
the best video poker players in the world who can play at an edge
play there?

Unlike other people I don't have a problem if you convinced them to
lower their paytables because people will play xxxx anyway under a
consulting deal, because that is just business and you and I are in
agreement that it is unrealistic to expect the casinos to give
anymore away than they have to. Other people here will feel even
this is selling out, but everyone knows you are a casino consultant
and you are selling your intellect in your products and there is no
American way reason for you not to sell to both casinos and patrons
this product. So long as your advice and products are intellectually
honest, I don't see a problem with it.

But being a rat is something different. Now you are not being paid
because you have a great brain, you are being paid to be a spy.
Maybe you feel if you turn some people in you will save your own
hide. This might work for a while, but keep in mind the casinos are
not your friends. They will turn on you the instance, you can no
longer be useful and if you are ostracized from the AP community
because no one trusts you, your value in many of your endeavors will
go down.

[Bob_Dancer1]

Caplatinum queried: But even I am suspicious of your relationships at
the Palms - why
would they let you play there and not others they have deemed as
skilled or promo restricted some people, but not you?

When the Palms first restricted 35 or so advantage players shortly after
they openen, my name was on the list, but I was also teaching video
poker classes there. I appealed to Maloof that restricting me wasn't the
message that was appropriate to someone who was teaching there. He
agreed and removed my name from that list. For a period of two years or
so thereafter, I played very little at the Palms.

I did begin playing there in early 2005. There are a number of strong
players that play there today, although if you were on that original
list of 35, you probably still are.

My relationship with George Maloof is rather casual. George makes it a
point to know every writer out there --- as he wants good press. He
knows me, Jean, Scott Krause, and numerous other writers. But I have had
no serious conversations with him (other than about my second novel)
with him for the past three or four years. We do greet each other by
name in passing if we see each other in the casino.

Bob Dancer

For a 3-day free trial of Video Poker for Winners, the best video poker
computer trainer ever invented, go to //www.videopokerforwinners.com

[Bob_Dancer1]

Harry wrote: My guess is that any remark by Bob was incidental to his
introduction to you and hardly intended to "out" you as a threat to the
casino.

Correct. I had never heard of Eric before I went to Turtle Creek --- or
since, for that matter. In the four visits I made there that year, I
spent maybe five or ten minutes total talking to Eric. That's it. It was
clear to me he wasn't a novice, but I don't know the guy or how good he
is from any sort of personal observation.

The slot director there at the time, named Jamison Hill, told ME all
about Eric and another guy who was friends with Eric. I was told that
these two players were ahead multiple tens of thousands of dollars at
the casino and in addition they won all of the promotions. Hill told me
that numerous players complained about these two players winning
everything. Eric and his friend were already on Turtle Creek's radar
long before I came along.

There is such a thing as wearing out your welcome at a casino --- of
going to the well too often. I was guilty of this at the MGM Grand and
Eric was guilty of this at Turtle Creek.

Bob Dancer

For a 3-day free trial of Video Poker for Winners, the best video poker
computer trainer ever invented, go to //www.videopokerforwinners.com

[Bob_Dancer1]

Jean said: I would have to respectfully disagree. You pointed me out to
a Venetian executive and discussed who I "really" was, back when I was
not so well-known, and when I asked why you would do that, you said you
didn't think it mattered. I thought it mattered a lot.

Jean, your sharing this incident with others might be the source of many
people believing that I identify advantage players. Unfortunately what
you are sharing isn't what occurred.

That incident happened in either late 2000 or early 2001. The way, Jean,
that it went down was as follows: One manager (D. C. Graham, VP of
marketing) was reacting to my pseudonym. He brought up your real name
and asked me if I knew you wrote under the name of "Jean Scott". I told
him I knew who you were. (I don't remember is this was before or after
your "Frugal Gambler" book. But he knew you wrote somewhere.) He asked
if you were a video poker expert. I laughed and told them that neither
you nor Brad were particularly strong players, and that you neither
played for high stakes nor long hours. That was the entire conversation.
(I informed you of it later as a courtesy. I certainly didn't "out" you
in any respect. D. C. brought your name up. I still don't think that
conversation mattered a lot. If anything, I improved the chances of you
remaining welcome there.) D. C. came to the reasonable decision that you
and Brad were "small fry" not worth worrying about. The Venetian
restricted me there shortly thereafter. My "sin" was being significantly
ahead primarily because of being dealt a $5 Five Play royal and
Shirley's was also for getting too many royals.

It would surprise me a lot, Jean, if any casino 86'd you for being too
good although it is possible that you could be over-royaled somewhere
and a casino manager over-reacted to that. (That could happen to anyone
and has sometimes happened to very weak players.) I'm not a fan of
yours, but I'm not going around ruining your welcome with casinos. Never
have. Never will. And even if I WERE to identify strong players (which I
don't), Jean, your name would not be in the top 200.

Bob Dancer

For a 3-day free trial of Video Poker for Winners, the best video poker
computer trainer ever invented, go to //www.videopokerforwinners.com

[Mickey]

Jean said: I would have to respectfully disagree. You pointed me

out to

a Venetian executive and discussed who I "really" was, back when I

was

not so well-known, and when I asked why you would do that, you said

you

didn't think it mattered. I thought it mattered a lot.

It doesn't matter. If your name is Bob Dancer.

Jean, your sharing this incident with others might be the source of

many

people believing that I identify advantage players. Unfortunately

what

you are sharing isn't what occurred.

Another case of Prancer trying to get someone to shut up.

That incident happened in either late 2000 or early 2001. The way,

Jean,

that it went down was as follows: One manager (D. C. Graham, VP of
marketing) was reacting to my pseudonym. He brought up your real

name

and asked me if I knew you wrote under the name of "Jean Scott". I

told

him I knew who you were. (I don't remember is this was before or

after

your "Frugal Gambler" book. But he knew you wrote somewhere.) He

asked

if you were a video poker expert.

She is just as expert as you are.

I laughed and told them that neither

you nor Brad were particularly strong players, and that you neither
played for high stakes nor long hours. That was the entire

conversation.

(I informed you of it later as a courtesy. I certainly didn't "out"

you

in any respect. D. C. brought your name up. I still don't think that
conversation mattered a lot. If anything, I improved the chances of

you

remaining welcome there.) D. C. came to the reasonable decision

that you

and Brad were "small fry" not worth worrying about.

Why didn't you explain all of that too her then?

The Venetian

restricted me there shortly thereafter. My "sin" was being

significantly

ahead primarily because of being dealt a $5 Five Play royal and
Shirley's was also for getting too many royals.

A couple of weak players got over royaled.

It would surprise me a lot, Jean, if any casino 86'd you for being

too

good although it is possible that you could be over-royaled

somewhere

and a casino manager over-reacted to that. (That could happen to

anyone

and has sometimes happened to very weak players.) I'm not a fan of
yours, but I'm not going around ruining your welcome with casinos.

Never

have. Never will. And even if I WERE to identify strong players

(which I

don't), Jean, your name would not be in the top 200.

Since you are famous for outing people name the 200 players.

Bob Dancer

For a 3-day free trial of Video Poker for Winners, the best video

poker

···

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Bob Dancer" <bob.dancer@...> wrote:

computer trainer ever invented, go to //www.videopokerforwinners.com

[2-WILD1]

>
> .....I laughed and told them that neither
> you nor Brad were particularly strong players, and that you

neither

> played for high stakes nor long hours.
.....
> ...It would surprise me a lot, Jean, if any casino 86'd you for
being too
> good although it is possible that you could be over-royaled

somewhere

> and a casino manager over-reacted to that. (That could happen to

anyone

> and has sometimes happened to very weak players.)
.....
And even if I WERE to identify strong players (which I
> don't), Jean, your name would not be in the top 200.
>
> Bob Dancer

You're a real class act, Bob.

For all his apparent success, it's obvious that Bob remains an
inadequate person threatened by the success of peers. Thus the need
to brag and put them down whenever possible. Allegations made by
palladin are quite consistent with this "M.O."

Best steer clear of him.

···

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "john_blutarski" <lvspartan@...> wrote:

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Bob Dancer" <bob.dancer@> wrote: