vpFREE2 Forums

Multi-Strike and Super Times Pay

Combined in one game. I can't find anything on the Internet that gives the EV of this on any game. Seems like a long time ago I read somewhere that adding STP reduces the MS return rather than adding to it??? But my memory is failing me these days!!!

Does anyone know the EV of this machine with an 8/5 Bonus Poker schedule? And do you just use the basic MS strategy???

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________________
Jean $¢ott, Frugal Gambler
http://queenofcomps.com/
You can read my blog at
http://jscott.lvablog.com/

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Depends slightly on the game , but in general goes up about .33. Sorry to say the gimmick multipliers are NOT ++, but about the same as only one of them applied.
In Jacks or better , the STP feature is neutral and the Free Ride is adjusted
to give about the same return. STP is 1 in 10 games,
with values from 2X-5X and an EV of 3X.
My problem has always been with deciding between 9/5 Super Double Bonus and 9/6 bonus deluxe. The SDB has slightly better EV, but with more complex strategy, and higher variance than BDLX..... best...Tom

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----- Original Message ----- From: "Jean Scott" <queenofcomps@cox.net>
To: "AA vpFREE Group" <vpFREE@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Sunday, October 09, 2011 1:28 AM
Subject: [vpFREE] Multi-Strike and Super Times Pay

Combined in one game. I can't find anything on the Internet that gives the EV of this on any game. Seems like a long time ago I read somewhere that adding STP reduces the MS return rather than adding to it??? But my memory is failing me these days!!!

Where did you find this game in bonus poker?

···

-----Original Message-----
From: Jean Scott <queenofcomps@cox.net>
To: AA vpFREE Group <vpFREE@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Sat, Oct 8, 2011 6:28 pm
Subject: [vpFREE] Multi-Strike and Super Times Pay

Combined in one game. I can't find anything on the Internet that gives the EV of this on any game. Seems like a long time ago I read somewhere that adding STP reduces the MS return rather than adding to it??? But my memory is failing me these days!!!

Does anyone know the EV of this machine with an 8/5 Bonus Poker schedule? And do you just use the basic MS strategy???

________________
Jean $¢ott, Frugal Gambler
http://queenofcomps.com/
You can read my blog at
http://jscott.lvablog.com/

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

<<Where did you find this game in bonus poker?>>

At the Hard Rock. Fun but oh so volatile!!

···

________________
Jean $¢ott, Frugal Gambler
http://queenofcomps.com/
You can read my blog at
http://jscott.lvablog.com/

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

To clarify, you DO use regular MS strategy?

···

________________
Jean $¢ott, Frugal Gambler
http://queenofcomps.com/
You can read my blog at
http://jscott.lvablog.com/

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I do, and like regular MS, switch to regular strategy at any 8X or higher hand.

···

----- Original Message ----- From: "Jean Scott" <queenofcomps@cox.net>
To: <vpFREE@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Sunday, October 09, 2011 11:31 PM
Subject: Re: [vpFREE] Multi-Strike and Super Times Pay

To clarify, you DO use regular MS strategy?
________________
Jean $�ott, Frugal Gambler
http://queenofcomps.com/
You can read my blog at
http://jscott.lvablog.com/

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

------------------------------------

vpFREE Links: http://members.cox.net/vpfree/Links.htm

Yahoo! Groups Links

<<I do, and like regular MS, switch to regular strategy at any 8X or higher hand.>>

Oh, so you would switch back to regular basic strategy if you had a 10x multiplier on the first 3 lines (with no free ride)??? That makes sense!!!

···

________________
Jean $¢ott, Frugal Gambler
http://queenofcomps.com/
You can read my blog at
http://jscott.lvablog.com/

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Very good catch on when to switch to basic strategy.
This thread on VP's "crack-cocaine" is making my arms itch in Boston.

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--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Jean Scott" <queenofcomps@...> wrote:

<<I do, and like regular MS, switch to regular strategy at any 8X or higher hand.>>

Oh, so you would switch back to regular basic strategy if you had a 10x multiplier on the first 3 lines (with no free ride)??? That makes sense!!!
________________
Jean $¢ott, Frugal Gambler
http://queenofcomps.com/
You can read my blog at
http://jscott.lvablog.com/

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I'm interested in the logic of the switch at a multiplier of 8x vs some other value. (It should be clear that the switch to regular strategy in regular MS has nothing to do with the multiplier on the top level ... it's simply that there's no further possible advancement, so regular strategy applies.)

I don't have access to good paytables for this game, so I'm not inclined to sweat the math right now (preoccupied with getting our Philly home on the market!) ... that said, I would think something like a 4x or stronger STP multiplier might be sufficient to strongly shift strategy on all lines to standard strategy.

Keep in mind, the 6/4/2 MS strategy serves to optimize the tradeoff between the value of a strong hit on the current level being played and the opportunity opened on higher levels by ANY hit.

As you strengthen the value of a hit on the current level (via STP multiplier), you lessen that comparative advantage of advancement relative to hitting big on the current level ... thus biasing play toward standard strategy.

- H.

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--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Jean Scott" <queenofcomps@...> wrote:

<<I do, and like regular MS, switch to regular strategy at any 8X or higher hand.>>

Oh, so you would switch back to regular basic strategy if you had a 10x multiplier on the first 3 lines (with no free ride)??? That makes sense!!!
________________
Jean $¢ott, Frugal Gambler
http://queenofcomps.com/
You can read my blog at
http://jscott.lvablog.com/

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

A good approximation is the 30/20/10 (6/4/2 * 5 coins per line) divided by
the STP multiplier when one comes up.

···

From: vpFREE@yahoogroups.com [mailto:vpF…@…com] On Behalf Of
vp_wiz
Sent: Monday, October 10, 2011 4:19 PM
To: vpFREE@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [vpFREE] Re: Multi-Strike and Super Times Pay

I'm interested in the logic of the switch at a multiplier of 8x vs some
other value. (It should be clear that the switch to regular strategy in
regular MS has nothing to do with the multiplier on the top level ... it's
simply that there's no further possible advancement, so regular strategy
applies.)

I don't have access to good paytables for this game, so I'm not inclined to
sweat the math right now (preoccupied with getting our Philly home on the
market!) ... that said, I would think something like a 4x or stronger STP
multiplier might be sufficient to strongly shift strategy on all lines to
standard strategy.

Keep in mind, the 6/4/2 MS strategy serves to optimize the tradeoff between
the value of a strong hit on the current level being played and the
opportunity opened on higher levels by ANY hit.

As you strengthen the value of a hit on the current level (via STP
multiplier), you lessen that comparative advantage of advancement relative
to hitting big on the current level ... thus biasing play toward standard
strategy.

- H.

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vpFREE%40yahoogroups.com> , "Jean
Scott" <queenofcomps@...> wrote:

<<I do, and like regular MS, switch to regular strategy at any 8X or

higher hand.>>

Oh, so you would switch back to regular basic strategy if you had a 10x

multiplier on the first 3 lines (with no free ride)??? That makes
sense!!!

________________
Jean $¢ott, Frugal Gambler
http://queenofcomps.com/
You can read my blog at
http://jscott.lvablog.com/

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

2x = 40%, 3x = 30%, 4x = 20% and 5x = 10%.

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From: vpFREE@yahoogroups.com [mailto:vpF…@…com] On Behalf Of Rick E. Percy
Sent: Monday, October 10, 2011 12:47 PM
To: vpFREE@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [vpFREE] Re: Multi-Strike and Super Times Pay

________________________________
I understand that a multiplier appears 10% of the time and its average value is 3. But does anyone know the relative frequency of each multiplier: 2x, 3x, 4x, and 5x?

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

An abbreviated reply, Howard, but I completely agree ... The 6/4/2 paytable augment adds 2 coins, per coin wagered, for each level to which a win on the current line potentially can advance you.

In factoring a STP mulitplier to assess optimal strategy, you can either multiply the current level paytable by the STP multiplier and still add the same 6/4/2 addition -or- just keep the same current level paytable and scale back the 6/4/2 addition by dividing it by the STP multiplier ... both achieve the same result.

What's not clear from your reply is your take on the suggestion (from a prior post to which I replied) to apply a simple tactic of applying standard strategy to play with any 8x+ STP multiplier (it may have been intended that this is the combination of STP and MS level multiplier).

Again, not having actually stepped through the details, it's my guess that this leaves an uncomfortable amount of EV on the table and that if one were to pursue such a simplified strategy, it would be more appropriate to adopt standard strategy at a lower STP multiplier (perhaps as low as something like 4x+).

- H.

···

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "pyiddy" <pyiddy@...> wrote:

A good approximation is the 30/20/10 (6/4/2 * 5 coins per line) divided by
the STP multiplier when one comes up.

vp_wiz wrote:
Sent: Monday, October 10, 2011 4:19 PM

I'm interested in the logic of the switch at a multiplier of 8x vs
some other value. (It should be clear that the switch to regular strategy in
regular MS has nothing to do with the multiplier on the top level
... it's simply that there's no further possible advancement, so
regular strategy applies.)

I don't have access to good paytables for this game, so I'm not inclined to
sweat the math right now (preoccupied with getting our Philly home on the
market!) ... that said, I would think something like a 4x or stronger STP
multiplier might be sufficient to strongly shift strategy on all lines to
standard strategy.

Keep in mind, the 6/4/2 MS strategy serves to optimize the tradeoff between
the value of a strong hit on the current level being played and the
opportunity opened on higher levels by ANY hit.

As you strengthen the value of a hit on the current level (via STP
multiplier), you lessen that comparative advantage of advancement relative
to hitting big on the current level ... thus biasing play toward standard
strategy.

- H.

— In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vpFREE%40yahoogroups.com> ,
Jean Scott" <queenofcomps@> wrote:
>
> <<I do, and like regular MS, switch to regular strategy at any 8X
or higher hand.>>
>
> Oh, so you would switch back to regular basic strategy if you had
a 10x multiplier on the first 3 lines (with no free ride)??? That
makes sense!!!