I know of OK Johnny Hale. I've dealt to him many
times over the past
21 years. I've also read his essays in just about
every publication to
show up in a poker room through those same years. Our
"disagreement" in this discussion boils down to imply
versus infer.
I kmow Johnny too. On opening night of the new Golden Nugget
Cardroom, Johnny and I went into action after the speeches, trying to
get the first game started. We both wanted to win the first hand
dealt. Johnny had won the last hand in the old GN cardroom back
in '87, then they walked across the street and he won the first hand
in the new Horseshoe cardroom. We got the first game going, 10-20,
drew for the button. I was under the gun with 77 and raised.
Johhny, right behind me with K8 said "This is the hand I've been
waiting for" and three-bet. everyone else got out. He spiked a King
on the flop and won the first hand in the new room. He bragged it up
to everybody then cashed out. He didn't even play through his
blinds. Lucky sucker.
Having not had the pleasure of reading the entire
post, in context, I
inferred Mr. Hale was writing about the present
situation in Las Vegas
card rooms. I stand by my original comments about
present-day situations in the industry.
I think cheating is a minor concern today.
One correction I could offer is OK's reference to
low-limit no-limit
hold'em (LLNLH). The correct term is "SMALL BLIND
no-limit hold 'em". To call it "Limit" and "No-limit"
is oxymoronic.
Okay, so let's go with SBNLH
As for history, the reason we did not see Small Blind
No-limit was
because the casinos WOULD NOT spread the game (until
relatively recently). Casinos make their money on
repetitive hands. Hand after hand, hour after hour,
day after day. The grind is what produced the drop.
During the sixties and seventies, people did not have
the disposable income that they have now. It was in
the houses best interest to keep that guy with his
somewhat limited
bankroll play as long as possible in order to let the
"grind" happen.
This was accomplished by artificially limiting his
losses with a limit bet.
Otherwise you would see these guys go broke in minutes
and then watch your game (and drop) go to hell.
In a side note, Bill Boyd (at the Golden Nugget in the
mid-sixties)also
instituted the concept of a limit on the rake. Rather
than try to "snatch" a lot of money in a short time
form a limited number of tables, he reasoned that he'd
get more drop if took a little money from a lot of
people. He also was one of the folks who "banned"
no-limit from his room, except in a tournament.
Boyd is also credited with applying split-limt to holdem. Like 4-8,
10-20, etc. Cardchasers get better pot odds and implied odds on
their longshot draws in split-limit as opposed to spread limit. They
still don't get the right price but they get a much better price than
spread limit. Consequently, their money lasts longer. Very
ingenius by Boyd. Split limit pretty much tood over LV poker.
The bottom line on the cheating situation in poker
TODAY: yes it
happens,but not as much as some would want you to
believe. As for cheating in the big bet games of the
sixties, I wasn't there so I can't comment
intelligently.
Yes, I think enought has been written on this subject, detracting
from the real story at hand.
I can't wait to hear what Mickey has observed during
his play in LV.
And the real story at hand is what a great opportunity the SBNLH
games of Las Vegas present.
Playing LV middle limit holdem your choices are few and the
competition stiff. At 8-16 you have a few games between Wynn and
Bellagio. At 10-20, your choice is Mirage (Maybe there is 10-20 at
Orleans or Red Rock). I went to Mirage on a Wednesday night at 7PM
and there was no game. They said it had just broken up. I took a
look at the two 20-40's going and the games were tough. It's the only
20-40 in LV. No thanks. At 15-30 there are a few games between
Bellagio and Wynn, tough competition. You've got 30-60 at Bellagio
and sometimes Wynn, tougher competition still.
Meanwhile, I walked around Midstrip on a Saturday afternoon and
counted 40 SBNLH games going. And that's just midstrip. I didn't
get to do a complete survey but my guess is there are probably
upwards of 70 of these games going in Las Vegas on a typical midweek
day, double that on the weekends. You can play this game 24/7/365.
NLH is a new trick for me. The old dog must learn a new trick
because there is too much opportunity there. So, for the past couple
of months I have been lugging around Doyle's Supersystem and
Sklansky's No-Limit Holdem: Theory and Practice. I'm fixing to add
another book: Professional No'Limit Holdem by Ed Miller and some
others writers. It's a 2plus2 book, which is Sklansky's publishing
compnay so I know the book has to be good.
So, my first trip in to give it a shot came up with an hourly rate of
$9 per hour. Laughable, but so what? I'm still learning. At least
I didn't get crushed. Which surprised my good friend "Al" out of
Reno.
The play in many of these games is bad, I mean REALLY bad. Players
are makiing huge mistakes. If the players in your game are not
making huge mistakes move to another table. Don't sit in a rocked
down game.
The bad play of others is the great opoortunity these games present
today. My friend Al has been preying on these games for the past
couple of years. He was flying back and forth between Reno and Las
Vegas alot, but closed up shop in Reno and moved to Las Vegas. There
is just too much money to be made.
Al is a world class SBNLH player. He is super strong. It is a great
pleasure just watching him play a hand. He has to be rated as one of
the very best SBNLH players in Las Vegas....and I know what his
hourly rate is. With records going back two years he knocks off $60
an hour in these games. That's an overall average. Sometimes his
expectation is much higher sometimes a little lower. It depends on
the circumstances.
Now, you can take that $60 an hour and multiple it out based on a 40
hour week and come up with $120,000 per year. But there is more to
it than that. There is a couple thousand dollars per year in comp
to start with. But the real addon is the freerolls. By putting in
60 hours at Caesars in August he qualified to play in a Super
Satellite awarding 15 seats in the final event of Caesars upcoming
October tournaments. These are $10,000 seats. Al is also a very
good tournament player; he's had his picture in the poker rags more
than one time. He has huge expectation in the Caesar's SBNLH games
plus he gets a free shot at some bigtime money. The Venetian has a
similar freeroll giviing away $50,000. 50 hours qualifies for the
event. There is every indication that these type freerolls will keep
on coming. One just needs to monitor the adds in Cardplayer Magazine
and Pokerplayernewspaper to keep abreast of what's coming up;.
So the total picture makes it a very, very good opportunity. The
only catch is I'm not the player Al is. But I'm working on it. You
should too. I'll settle for half as good. It's a challenge I very
much look forward too.
Good luck.
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--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, george lee <glee4ever@...> wrote: