vpFREE2 Forums

Mohegan Sun FP Pick'em VP

#1

I just made a trip playing FP Pick'em (dollar machine) at Mohegan Sun. I was beat, down about $4,000 before recovered a litttle. A few of the rgular players were playing. They too claimed to have lost big. There were hardly any payout. I played all day on the first day without getting any FOAK or higher.

I Now wonder if the machine is truly random. Could it be that the payout tables ware made up by the Mohegan Sun just for show so as to attract players?

I really wonder, does anyone has any idea?

#2

I think you just hit a really bad streak. I've seen those machines have what seem like a never-ending series of handpays.

Personally, I don't particularly like those machines because they are 1.) old 2.) slo-o-o-o-w 3.) usually occupied by groups of "regulars" who hold the machines for each other to the point where its difficult to get on them when you want to. and most importantly, 4.) I have much better luck on other types of machines.
But I don't think there's anything crooked about them

"In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice. But, in practice, there is." - Yogi Berra

···

________________________________
From: mikeam7788 <mikeam7788@yahoo.com>
To: vpFREE@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sat, April 24, 2010 8:47:32 PM
Subject: [vpFREE] Mohegan Sun FP Pick'em VP

I just made a trip playing FP Pick'em (dollar machine) at Mohegan Sun. I was beat, down about $4,000 before recovered a litttle. A few of the rgular players were playing. They too claimed to have lost big. There were hardly any payout. I played all day on the first day without getting any FOAK or higher.

I Now wonder if the machine is truly random. Could it be that the payout tables ware made up by the Mohegan Sun just for show so as to attract players?

I really wonder, does anyone has any idea?

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

#3

You ask "if the machine is truly random?". The general assumption is that VP and slots are random and the outcomes just happen regardless. Are you familiar with the 2 coin 3-reel Quick Hit machines? They are still in some casinos with the progressive payable when 3 Quick Hits appear on any position on the reels. If they line up on the single payline they pay 5000 credits. The local casino here has them as well as a casino i go to in Quebec. On a dollar machine the progressive starts at $1,000. You will rarely see that progressive go past $1,200. Although the display has enough room for the amount to go much higher it doesn't. The progressive never is even at $1,400. If it was 'random' then the worst outcome would occur sometimes and the progressive would climb to the machine limit. Never does. In years it never has. Hard to believe this is completely random. So if it isn't completely random then why can't other machines be set this way. What about the machines that have the mystery jackpot that cannot exceed a certain amount. Are they the only ones being honest about a pre-determined level of play necessary for a payout. Years ago the FP pick'em needed maybe an hour or two to see a few 4oak's whereby now you can play all day and not see any. What changed? The randomness? Also one time years ago i was playing for hours on a normal 1 line poker machine and couldn't get a 4oak. I told my friendly hostess at the time that something must have changed in the machine. She confided that she sees the slot techs do something then the machines don't pay as well as before. Then sometimes they set them and for a few days they pay better. She eventually quit because she felt guilty being part of this operation that seemed to be cheating people. I am in Ontario, Canada, not Nevada. Here we have gas pumps that don't dispense the volume stated and the government acknowledges it so why can't the gambling machines also be set to be doing something other than what it says.

···

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "mikeam7788" <mikeam7788@...> wrote:

I just made a trip playing FP Pick'em (dollar machine) at Mohegan Sun. I was beat, down about $4,000 before recovered a litttle. A few of the rgular players were playing. They too claimed to have lost big. There were hardly any payout. I played all day on the first day without getting any FOAK or higher.

I Now wonder if the machine is truly random. Could it be that the payout tables ware made up by the Mohegan Sun just for show so as to attract players?

I really wonder, does anyone has any idea?

#4

Have been playing at Mohegan Sun since pick'em was put in. Believe me there are days when you doubt there randomness. Play 7 hours no four of a kinds. But then play one day and hit 4 straight flushes and 3 four of a kinds on same machine in 7 hour period. My play is around 3.5 million coin in per year. If I had any doubt in there randomness I would not be playing them.

Thanks

···

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "stormin96" <pcolborne@...> wrote:

You ask "if the machine is truly random?". The general assumption is that VP and slots are random and the outcomes just happen regardless. Are you familiar with the 2 coin 3-reel Quick Hit machines? They are still in some casinos with the progressive payable when 3 Quick Hits appear on any position on the reels. If they line up on the single payline they pay 5000 credits. The local casino here has them as well as a casino i go to in Quebec. On a dollar machine the progressive starts at $1,000. You will rarely see that progressive go past $1,200. Although the display has enough room for the amount to go much higher it doesn't. The progressive never is even at $1,400. If it was 'random' then the worst outcome would occur sometimes and the progressive would climb to the machine limit. Never does. In years it never has. Hard to believe this is completely random. So if it isn't completely random then why can't other machines be set this way. What about the machines that have the mystery jackpot that cannot exceed a certain amount. Are they the only ones being honest about a pre-determined level of play necessary for a payout. Years ago the FP pick'em needed maybe an hour or two to see a few 4oak's whereby now you can play all day and not see any. What changed? The randomness? Also one time years ago i was playing for hours on a normal 1 line poker machine and couldn't get a 4oak. I told my friendly hostess at the time that something must have changed in the machine. She confided that she sees the slot techs do something then the machines don't pay as well as before. Then sometimes they set them and for a few days they pay better. She eventually quit because she felt guilty being part of this operation that seemed to be cheating people. I am in Ontario, Canada, not Nevada. Here we have gas pumps that don't dispense the volume stated and the government acknowledges it so why can't the gambling machines also be set to be doing something other than what it says.

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "mikeam7788" <mikeam7788@> wrote:
>
> I just made a trip playing FP Pick'em (dollar machine) at Mohegan Sun. I was beat, down about $4,000 before recovered a litttle. A few of the rgular players were playing. They too claimed to have lost big. There were hardly any payout. I played all day on the first day without getting any FOAK or higher.
>
> I Now wonder if the machine is truly random. Could it be that the payout tables ware made up by the Mohegan Sun just for show so as to attract players?
>
> I really wonder, does anyone has any idea?
>

#5

I have asked myself on several boards if there is some state (meaning NON Indian) authority which determines the game is fair-like Nevada and New Jersey have.
I have never received any answer whatsoever.

···

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "mikeam7788" <mikeam7788@...> wrote:

I just made a trip playing FP Pick'em (dollar machine) at Mohegan Sun. I was beat, down about $4,000 before recovered a litttle. A few of the rgular players were playing. They too claimed to have lost big. There were hardly any payout. I played all day on the first day without getting any FOAK or higher.

I Now wonder if the machine is truly random. Could it be that the payout tables ware made up by the Mohegan Sun just for show so as to attract players?

I really wonder, does anyone has any idea?

#6

I have asked myself on several boards if there is some state (meaning
NON Indian) authority which determines the game is fair-like Nevada and
New Jersey have.
I have never received any answer whatsoever.

Did you ask yourself why not?

Cogno

#7

I have asked myself on several boards if there is some state (meaning

  > NON Indian) authority which determines the game is fair-like Nevada and
  > New Jersey have.
  > I have never received any answer whatsoever.

  Did you ask yourself why not?

  Cogno

  Cogno, you made me laugh out loud.

  Valerie

__________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 5063 (20100426) __________

The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.

http://www.eset.com

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

#8

Dear Hartbarger,
You have a good point. You can never tell when is good or bad day.
I think that amount you play can tell a lot about the odds of these machinese in general.
With around 3.5 million play per year; may I ask you you have been up or down?
Thank you for your time.

···

________________________________
From: hartbarger11 <mhart@gogtt.net>
To: vpFREE@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Mon, April 26, 2010 9:44:58 AM
Subject: [vpFREE] Re: Mohegan Sun FP Pick'em VP

Have been playing at Mohegan Sun since pick'em was put in. Believe me there are days when you doubt there randomness. Play 7 hours no four of a kinds. But then play one day and hit 4 straight flushes and 3 four of a kinds on same machine in 7 hour period. My play is around 3.5 million coin in per year. If I had any doubt in there randomness I would not be playing them.

Thanks

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups. com, "stormin96" <pcolborne@. ..> wrote:

You ask "if the machine is truly random?". The general assumption is that VP and slots are random and the outcomes just happen regardless. Are you familiar with the 2 coin 3-reel Quick Hit machines? They are still in some casinos with the progressive payable when 3 Quick Hits appear on any position on the reels. If they line up on the single payline they pay 5000 credits. The local casino here has them as well as a casino i go to in Quebec. On a dollar machine the progressive starts at $1,000. You will rarely see that progressive go past $1,200. Although the display has enough room for the amount to go much higher it doesn't. The progressive never is even at $1,400. If it was 'random' then the worst outcome would occur sometimes and the progressive would climb to the machine limit. Never does. In years it never has. Hard to believe this is completely random. So if it isn't completely random then why can't other machines be set this way. What about the

machines that have the mystery jackpot that cannot exceed a certain amount. Are they the only ones being honest about a pre-determined level of play necessary for a payout. Years ago the FP pick'em needed maybe an hour or two to see a few 4oak's whereby now you can play all day and not see any. What changed? The randomness? Also one time years ago i was playing for hours on a normal 1 line poker machine and couldn't get a 4oak. I told my friendly hostess at the time that something must have changed in the machine. She confided that she sees the slot techs do something then the machines don't pay as well as before. Then sometimes they set them and for a few days they pay better. She eventually quit because she felt guilty being part of this operation that seemed to be cheating people. I am in Ontario, Canada, not Nevada. Here we have gas pumps that don't dispense the volume stated and the government acknowledges it so why can't the gambling machines also
be set to be doing something other than what it says.

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups. com, "mikeam7788" <mikeam7788@ > wrote:
>
> I just made a trip playing FP Pick'em (dollar machine) at Mohegan Sun. I was beat, down about $4,000 before recovered a litttle. A few of the rgular players were playing. They too claimed to have lost big. There were hardly any payout. I played all day on the first day without getting any FOAK or higher.
>
> I Now wonder if the machine is truly random. Could it be that the payout tables ware made up by the Mohegan Sun just for show so as to attract players?
>
> I really wonder, does anyone has any idea?
>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

#9

It's not funny at all, to those of us in New England.
Anybody with an actual answer instead of some pathetic grammatical double entendre?

···

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Valerie Pollard" <vpollard@...> wrote:

  > I have asked myself on several boards if there is some state (meaning
  > NON Indian) authority which determines the game is fair-like Nevada and
  > New Jersey have.
  > I have never received any answer whatsoever.

  Did you ask yourself why not?

  Cogno

  Cogno, you made me laugh out loud.

  Valerie

__________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 5063 (20100426) __________

The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.

http://www.eset.com

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

#10

I'm from New England and I thought I was hilarious.

Cogno

···

-----Original Message-----
From: vpFREE@yahoogroups.com [mailto:vpF…@…com] On Behalf
Of mike
Sent: Tuesday, April 27, 2010 6:46 AM
To: vpFREE@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [vpFREE] Re: Mohegan Sun FP Pick'em VP

It's not funny at all, to those of us in New England.
Anybody with an actual answer instead of some pathetic grammatical
double entendre?

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Valerie Pollard" <vpollard@...> wrote:
>
>
>
> > I have asked myself on several boards if there is some state
(meaning
> > NON Indian) authority which determines the game is fair-like
Nevada and
> > New Jersey have.
> > I have never received any answer whatsoever.
>
> Did you ask yourself why not?
>
> Cogno
>
>
>
> Cogno, you made me laugh out loud.
>
> Valerie
>
>
>
> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus
signature database 5063 (20100426) __________
>
> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.
>
> http://www.eset.com
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

------------------------------------

vpFREE Links: http://members.cox.net/vpfree/Links.htm

Yahoo! Groups Links

#11

well, i lived in new england for almost a decade and i, too, thought it was pretty darn funny.

(and it was not in any way a double entendre...it was, perhaps, more an example of the socratic method being used to stimulate critical thinking. what he did was simply ask a question!)

···

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Cogno Scienti" <cognoscienti@...> wrote:

I'm from New England and I thought I was hilarious.

Cogno

> -----Original Message-----
> From: vpFREE@yahoogroups.com [mailto:vpF…@…com] On Behalf
> Of mike
> Sent: Tuesday, April 27, 2010 6:46 AM
> To: vpFREE@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [vpFREE] Re: Mohegan Sun FP Pick'em VP
>
> It's not funny at all, to those of us in New England. Anybody with an actual answer instead of some pathetic grammatical double entendre?

#12

Every state that authorizes casino gaming has a gaming regulation board.
Some do not have their own tests made but rely on prior approvals. Since the
same independent labs would run the tests this makes sense.

···

-----Original Message-----
From: vpFREE@yahoogroups.com [mailto:vpF…@…com] On Behalf Of
mike
Sent: Monday, April 26, 2010 4:09 PM
To: vpFREE@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [vpFREE] Re: Mohegan Sun FP Pick'em VP

I have asked myself on several boards if there is some state (meaning NON
Indian) authority which determines the game is fair-like Nevada and New
Jersey have.
I have never received any answer whatsoever.

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "mikeam7788" <mikeam7788@...> wrote:

I just made a trip playing FP Pick'em (dollar machine) at Mohegan Sun. I

was beat, down about $4,000 before recovered a litttle. A few of the rgular
players were playing. They too claimed to have lost big. There were hardly
any payout. I played all day on the first day without getting any FOAK or
higher.

I Now wonder if the machine is truly random. Could it be that the payout

tables ware made up by the Mohegan Sun just for show so as to attract
players?

I really wonder, does anyone has any idea?

------------------------------------

vpFREE Links: http://members.cox.net/vpfree/Links.htm

Yahoo! Groups Links

#13

Some people are apparently unfamiliar with the readily available "Slot Machine Manual" of January 2010 from the NJ Casino Control Commission Division of Compliance. It makes clear that the State of New Jersey conducts its own tests. Particular attention should be paid to Section XIV Page 3, Section XVII Pages 1 and 2, Section XIX Pages 2 and 3, as well as N.J.A.C. 19:46-1.22, 1.26 and 1.28.

···

On 4/27/2010 3:18 PM, Bill Coleman wrote:

Every state that authorizes casino gaming has a gaming regulation board.
Some do not have their own tests made but rely on prior approvals. Since the
same independent labs would run the tests this makes sense.

=======
Email scanned by PC Tools - No viruses or spyware found.
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#14

Dear Bill Coleman,
Thank you for your infomation. You are knowledgable.
What about the Indian casino in Conneticut? Any test compliance requirement? Who is governing?

Hing

···

________________________________
From: MHS <mspevack@optonline.net>
To: vpFREE@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tue, April 27, 2010 5:57:49 PM
Subject: Re: [vpFREE] Re: Mohegan Sun FP Pick'em VP

On 4/27/2010 3:18 PM, Bill Coleman wrote:

Every state that authorizes casino gaming has a gaming regulation board.
Some do not have their own tests made but rely on prior approvals.
Since the
same independent labs would run the tests this makes sense.

Some people are apparently unfamiliar with the readily available "Slot
Machine Manual" of January 2010 from the NJ Casino Control Commission
Division of Compliance. It makes clear that the State of New Jersey
conducts its own tests. Particular attention should be paid to Section
XIV Page 3, Section XVII Pages 1 and 2, Section XIX Pages 2 and 3, as
well as N.J.A.C. 19:46-1.22, 1.26 and 1.28.

=======
Email scanned by PC Tools - No viruses or spyware found.
(Email Guard: 7.0.0.18, Virus/Spyware Database: 6.14870)
http://www.pctools. com/

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

#15

Nobody is questioning NJ. The issue is CONNECTICUT.

···

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, MHS <mspevack@...> wrote:

On 4/27/2010 3:18 PM, Bill Coleman wrote:
>
> Every state that authorizes casino gaming has a gaming regulation board.
> Some do not have their own tests made but rely on prior approvals.
> Since the
> same independent labs would run the tests this makes sense.
>
Some people are apparently unfamiliar with the readily available "Slot
Machine Manual" of January 2010 from the NJ Casino Control Commission
Division of Compliance. It makes clear that the State of New Jersey
conducts its own tests. Particular attention should be paid to Section
XIV Page 3, Section XVII Pages 1 and 2, Section XIX Pages 2 and 3, as
well as N.J.A.C. 19:46-1.22, 1.26 and 1.28.

=======
Email scanned by PC Tools - No viruses or spyware found.
(Email Guard: 7.0.0.18, Virus/Spyware Database: 6.14870)
http://www.pctools.com/

#16

This is the inaccurate statement: "the same independent labs would run the tests."

···

On 4/30/2010 8:48 AM, mike wrote:

Nobody is questioning NJ. The issue is CONNECTICUT.

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vpFREE%40yahoogroups.com>, MHS <mspevack@...> wrote:
>
> On 4/27/2010 3:18 PM, Bill Coleman wrote:
> >
> > Every state that authorizes casino gaming has a gaming regulation board.
> > Some do not have their own tests made but rely on prior approvals.
> > Since the
> > same independent labs would run the tests this makes sense.
> >
> Some people are apparently unfamiliar with the readily available "Slot
> Machine Manual" of January 2010 from the NJ Casino Control Commission
> Division of Compliance. It makes clear that the State of New Jersey
> conducts its own tests. Particular attention should be paid to Section
> XIV Page 3, Section XVII Pages 1 and 2, Section XIX Pages 2 and 3, as
> well as N.J.A.C. 19:46-1.22, 1.26 and 1.28.

=======
Email scanned by PC Tools - No viruses or spyware found.
(Email Guard: 7.0.0.18, Virus/Spyware Database: 6.14900)
http://www.pctools.com/

#17

Connecticut has VERY strict regulations. According to the compact with the tribe all machines must be approved for use by NJ. In addition, the tribe has its own regulators, is subject to Federal regulation and the Connecticut state gaming authority also has oversight responsibility. Since NJ regs are tighter than Nevada you are probably more secure playing there than we are in LV. <g>

B

···

-----Original Message-----
From: vpFREE@yahoogroups.com [mailto:vpF…@…com] On Behalf Of Michael Tan
Sent: Thursday, April 29, 2010 5:03 PM
To: vpFREE@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [vpFREE] Re: Mohegan Sun FP Pick'em VP

Dear Bill Coleman,
Thank you for your infomation. You are knowledgable.
What about the Indian casino in Conneticut? Any test compliance requirement? Who is governing?

Hing

________________________________
From: MHS <mspevack@optonline.net>
To: vpFREE@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tue, April 27, 2010 5:57:49 PM
Subject: Re: [vpFREE] Re: Mohegan Sun FP Pick'em VP

�
On 4/27/2010 3:18 PM, Bill Coleman wrote:

Every state that authorizes casino gaming has a gaming regulation board.
Some do not have their own tests made but rely on prior approvals.
Since the
same independent labs would run the tests this makes sense.

Some people are apparently unfamiliar with the readily available "Slot
Machine Manual" of January 2010 from the NJ Casino Control Commission
Division of Compliance. It makes clear that the State of New Jersey
conducts its own tests. Particular attention should be paid to Section
XIV Page 3, Section XVII Pages 1 and 2, Section XIX Pages 2 and 3, as
well as N.J.A.C. 19:46-1.22, 1.26 and 1.28.

=======
Email scanned by PC Tools - No viruses or spyware found.
(Email Guard: 7.0.0.18, Virus/Spyware Database: 6.14870)
http://www.pctools. com/

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

------------------------------------

vpFREE Links: http://members.cox.net/vpfree/Links.htm

Yahoo! Groups Links

#18

Thnaks B!
Hing

···

________________________________
From: Bill Coleman <vphobby2@cox.net>
To: vpFREE@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Fri, April 30, 2010 12:52:09 PM
Subject: RE: [vpFREE] Re: Mohegan Sun FP Pick'em VP

Connecticut has VERY strict regulations. According to the compact with the tribe all machines must be approved for use by NJ. In addition, the tribe has its own regulators, is subject to Federal regulation and the Connecticut state gaming authority also has oversight responsibility. Since NJ regs are tighter than Nevada you are probably more secure playing there than we are in LV. <g>

B

-----Original Message-----
From: vpFREE@yahoogroups. com [mailto:vpFREE@yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of Michael Tan
Sent: Thursday, April 29, 2010 5:03 PM
To: vpFREE@yahoogroups. com
Subject: Re: [vpFREE] Re: Mohegan Sun FP Pick'em VP

Dear Bill Coleman,
Thank you for your infomation. You are knowledgable.
What about the Indian casino in Conneticut? Any test compliance requirement? Who is governing?

Hing

____________ _________ _________ __
From: MHS <mspevack@optonline. net>
To: vpFREE@yahoogroups. com
Sent: Tue, April 27, 2010 5:57:49 PM
Subject: Re: [vpFREE] Re: Mohegan Sun FP Pick'em VP

�
On 4/27/2010 3:18 PM, Bill Coleman wrote:

Every state that authorizes casino gaming has a gaming regulation board.
Some do not have their own tests made but rely on prior approvals.
Since the
same independent labs would run the tests this makes sense.

Some people are apparently unfamiliar with the readily available "Slot
Machine Manual" of January 2010 from the NJ Casino Control Commission
Division of Compliance. It makes clear that the State of New Jersey
conducts its own tests. Particular attention should be paid to Section
XIV Page 3, Section XVII Pages 1 and 2, Section XIX Pages 2 and 3, as
well as N.J.A.C. 19:46-1.22, 1.26 and 1.28.

=======
Email scanned by PC Tools - No viruses or spyware found.
(Email Guard: 7.0.0.18, Virus/Spyware Database: 6.14870)
http://www.pctools. com/

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

------------ --------- --------- ------

vpFREE Links: http://members. cox.net/vpfree/ Links.htm

Yahoo! Groups Links

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]