By my rough calculation, I think this is over 100% return, but is it
just good? Or is it VERY good? This is 8/5 Jacks or Better, not
Bonus Poker.
Is 8/5 Progressive at $9k very attractive?
What denomination?
···
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "caribou_123" <caribou123@...> wrote:
By my rough calculation, I think this is over 100% return, but is it
just good? Or is it VERY good? This is 8/5 Jacks or Better, not
Bonus Poker.
By my rough calculation, I think this is over 100% return, but is it
just good? Or is it VERY good? This is 8/5 Jacks or Better, not
Bonus Poker.
Although you did not state a denomination, I am assuming $'s. If so, it is
slightly over 100.2%. If it is quarters, I'm on the next plane for an
almost 118% return.
Nudge
···
From: "caribou_123"
Sent: Wednesday, October 25, 2006 1:48 PM
Subject: [vpFREE] Is 8/5 Progressive at $9k very attractive?
Although you did not state a denomination, I am assuming $'s. If
so, it is
slightly over 100.2%. If it is quarters, I'm on the next plane for an
almost 118% return.
Nudge
Sorry. Yes, dollars
···
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "nudge51" <nudge51@...> wrote:
If I had some extra time I'd play it. The play gets better with each
coin dropped.
Cheers....Jeep
···
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "caribou_123" <caribou123@...> wrote:
By my rough calculation, I think this is over 100% return, but is it
just good? Or is it VERY good? This is 8/5 Jacks or Better, not
Bonus Poker.
caribou_123 wrote:
By my rough calculation, I think this is over 100% return, but is it
just good? Or is it VERY good? This is 8/5 Jacks or Better, not
Bonus Poker.
I deem it largely unplayable. The relatively limited advantage will
entail a sizable bankroll to survive the downside of play (potentially
compensated by generous cashback). It's accessable only to those who
are very secure with $2 play of 9/6 Jacks or stronger ER games.
The expected drain between royals with optimized strategy is about
5.8% of wagers. That compares with 3% for standard 9/6 Jacks.
- Harry
Au contraire Harry
The game is playable; depending where you play. Don't forget, the game
keeps getting better. It depends on how many games on the link. If the
progressive has 4 games on the link, then it would be unplayable using
your risk to the bankroll. Wouldn't be worth it to me either. However,
the Mirage used to have one of these progressives that had probably 30
seats linked. Be there on a busy Saturday night and the meter would be
over 10G quickly. So the plan is to sit at machine, Order coffee, take
a trip to restroom and comfortably start playing. By time you goof
around the meter has run a lot. As meter tops 10 most play seriously.
Play improves fast till prog. hit. You are right about bankroll. Even
if the meter is $15,000 you still need the funds to play. If your not
hitting your fair share of 4kds, a player underfunded will be sent to
the showers quickly. It's the nature of the beast.
Cheers....Jeep
.
.
···
.--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Harry Porter" <harry.porter@...> wrote:
caribou_123 wrote:
> By my rough calculation, I think this is over 100% return, but is it
> just good? Or is it VERY good? This is 8/5 Jacks or Better, not
> Bonus Poker.I deem it largely unplayable. The relatively limited advantage will
entail a sizable bankroll to survive the downside of play (potentially
compensated by generous cashback). It's accessable only to those who
are very secure with $2 play of 9/6 Jacks or stronger ER games.The expected drain between royals with optimized strategy is about
5.8% of wagers. That compares with 3% for standard 9/6 Jacks.- Harry
How much does your ev take a hit in relationship to the number of
people or games being played on the progressive?
Au contraire Harry
The game is playable; depending where you play. Don't forget, the
game
keeps getting better. It depends on how many games on the link. If
the
progressive has 4 games on the link, then it would be unplayable
using
your risk to the bankroll. Wouldn't be worth it to me either.
However,
the Mirage used to have one of these progressives that had probably
30
seats linked. Be there on a busy Saturday night and the meter would
be
over 10G quickly. So the plan is to sit at machine, Order coffee,
take
a trip to restroom and comfortably start playing. By time you goof
around the meter has run a lot. As meter tops 10 most play
seriously.
Play improves fast till prog. hit. You are right about bankroll.
Even
if the meter is $15,000 you still need the funds to play. If your
not
hitting your fair share of 4kds, a player underfunded will be sent
to
the showers quickly. It's the nature of the beast.
Cheers....Jeep
.
.
.--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Harry Porter" <harry.porter@>
wrote:
>
> caribou_123 wrote:
> > By my rough calculation, I think this is over 100% return, but
is it
> > just good? Or is it VERY good? This is 8/5 Jacks or Better,
not
> > Bonus Poker.
>
> I deem it largely unplayable. The relatively limited advantage
will
> entail a sizable bankroll to survive the downside of play
(potentially
> compensated by generous cashback). It's accessable only to those
who
···
-- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "whitejeeps" <whitejeeps@...> wrote:
> are very secure with $2 play of 9/6 Jacks or stronger ER games.
>
> The expected drain between royals with optimized strategy is about
> 5.8% of wagers. That compares with 3% for standard 9/6 Jacks.
>
> - Harry
>
It doesn't.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
···
On 10/26/06, upside1581 <bradritt@bellsouth.net> wrote:
How much does your ev take a hit in relationship to the number of
people or games being played on the progressive?
If you are competing other players for the same progressive doesn't
that diminish your chances of hiting that progressive thus reducing the
ev?
···
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "King Fish" <vpkingfish@...> wrote:
On 10/26/06, upside1581 <bradritt@...> wrote:
>
> How much does your ev take a hit in relationship to the number of
> people or games being played on the progressive?It doesn't.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Yes, but only in volume, not in percent.
Did anyone ever say where this progressive was? It might actually be
quite good after so many days of discussion.
···
If you are competing other players for the same progressive doesn't
that diminish your chances of hiting that progressive thus reducing the
ev?--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "King Fish" <vpkingfish@...> wrote:
On 10/26/06, upside1581 <bradritt@...> wrote:
>
> How much does your ev take a hit in relationship to the number of
> people or games being played on the progressive?It doesn't.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
vpFREE Links: http://members.cox.net/vpfree/Links.htm
Yahoo! Groups Links
upside1581 wrote:
If you are competing other players for the same progressive doesn't
that diminish your chances of hiting that progressive thus reducing
the ev?
Yes. However, the direct offset is that if you do hit, you benefit
from the contribution of their play to the meter climb. The two
effects cancel each other out.
However, there's a rather subtle (modest) manner in which you can look
for other players on the bank to reduce your EV.
The expectation is that less knowledgable players will
over-agressively chase the royal (vs optimal strategy) for the current
meter. On average you can expect that the royal will be hit over a
shorter cycle than would be the case if all players were playing
"optimally".
The consequence is that the expected meter when you hit the royal
(over the course of time) will be less than if all players were
playing optimal strategy (or if you were playing a single machine
progressive). This translates into a reduced ER/EV.
And you thought it was only when you sat next to an obnoxious player
that someone else could impact your EV 
...
- Harry
Harry wrote:
The expectation is that less knowledgable players will
over-agressively chase the royal (vs optimal strategy) for the current
meter.
I haven't done any serious studies, but my impression is just the
opposite. I've seen many players on very high meters holding high
pairs and 4-flushes over 3 to a royal. I doubt if many players who
don't have the discipline of a professional would keep 3 to a royal
over 2 pair (although I've only heard of one person who has ever hit a
royal after discarding 2 pair) or break up a king high straight flush.
Harry wrote: The expectation is that less knowledgable players will
over-agressively
chase the royal (vs optimal strategy) for the current meter.
Tom Robertson replied: I haven't done any serious studies, but my
impression is just the opposite. I've seen many players on very high
meters holding high pairs and 4-flushes over 3 to a royal. I doubt if
many players who don't have the discipline of a professional would keep
3 to a royal over 2 pair (although I've only heard of one person who has
ever hit a royal after discarding 2 pair) or break up a king high
straight flush.
Tom has a point, but with a $9K royal on a 8/5 Jacks game,
making either of the plays he mentions would be foolhardy. I think Harry
was talking about such combinations as 'JT8' or 'QJ9'. Many players go
for the royal only on these combinations, but the progressive needs to
be quite a bit higher than $9K for these plays to be correct. How much
higher? Depends on the other two cards in the hand.
Bob Dancer
For the best in video poker information, visit www.bobdancer.com
or call 1-800-244-2224 M-F 9-5 Pacific Time.
Tom Robertson wrote:
I haven't done any serious studies, but my impression is just the
opposite. I've seen many players on very high meters holding high
pairs and 4-flushes over 3 to a royal.
Obviously I was shooting from the hip a bit. However, on occasion
I've spotted a player holding just a single high card rather than two
unsuited in order to leave a 4-cd RF draw open.
You can take comfort that if another player on the bank is playing
less aggressively for the RF than warranted, then your EV for the play
is increased - the expected meter value on the bank when hit will be
higher (a converse example to what I originally detailed).
- Harry