Thanks Bob but is it worth remembering all that under a $1219. What is the
loss?
The Grump
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Hold Da Ace Ten Suited
The Grump said: Thanks Bob but is it worth remembering all that under a
$1219. What is the
loss?
It's worth it to me, but I am not a recreational player.
I rarely play any video poker game that I haven't mastered --- which
includes all penalty card situations. On progressives, the game I play
the most is 8/5 Bonus progressive, and I have almost all of the
breakpoints memorized at relevant levels.
Others on this site say that learning penalty cards is a waste of time.
I disagree. Anyone who forces himself to learn the penalty cards and the
breakpoints has a MUCH better grasp of the game than those who go for
the short cuts.
You're welcome to calculate the cost of doing this yourself --- however
you want to do it. So far as I'm concerned, the cost is small compared
to the benefits. Others disagree.
Bob Dancer
For the best in video poker information, visit www.bobdancer.com
or call 1-800-244-2224 M-F 9-5 Pacific Time.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
The Grump said: Thanks Bob but is it worth remembering all that
under a
$1219. What is the
loss?It's worth it to me, but I am not a recreational player.
I rarely play any video poker game that I haven't mastered --- which
includes all penalty card situations. On progressives, the game I
play
the most is 8/5 Bonus progressive, and I have almost all of the
breakpoints memorized at relevant levels.Others on this site say that learning penalty cards is a waste of
time.
I disagree. Anyone who forces himself to learn the penalty cards
and the
breakpoints has a MUCH better grasp of the game than those who go
for
the short cuts.
You're welcome to calculate the cost of doing this yourself ---
however
you want to do it. So far as I'm concerned, the cost is small
compared
to the benefits. Others disagree.
Bob Dancer
It's nice to see another post on penalty cards. I believe this topic
is worthwhile and was disappointed that the previous thread was
terminated.
My own opinion is somewhere in the middle ground. I learn and use
some penalty card plays for most games. This helps me focus and, I
believe, helps me be more accurate. On the other hand, I find some
situations to be more distracting and slow my play so much that they
are not all the useful and can even lead to the tree-forest problem.
In addition, there are some games where penalty cards may make a
substantial difference and games where taking extra time to learn
these situations is time well spent. I play a lot of OEJs and simply
by the number of times interference situations come into play makes
me believe the cost of mistakes is well above a deuces game for
example.
I also don't think the decision should be based on something as ill-
defined as a "recreational player". I know several players who
supplement their income through VP. Most of these players don't have
large bankrolls so they usually play .25 - 1.00 machines. The
additional $$ they earn may be just as important to them as it is to
a professional player. Maybe we need a new term for these players (I
really don't like semi-pro).
It would be interesting to have a cost-analysis done on some of the
different VP games. You know, those high paid consultants that come
in and recommend spoons in the waiters pocket 
Dick
···
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Bob Dancer" <bob.dancer@c...> wrote:
Where are all of the $5 and up progressives? A quick glance of the LV Index yields the following:
$5 BPAF - Binion's
$5 BP - Sam's Town, GVR
$5 JOB - Fiesta Rancho
I know that El Cortez has a $5 8/5 DDB prog that isn't listed in the database. Has someone compiled a complete list? I'm aware of 5-cards' list at http://videopoker.fws1.com/progressives.htm, but it doesn't list $5 machines.
And Bob, do you care to divulge what those adjustments are to 8/5 BP? Or is that left as an exercise for us?
John
···
Bob Dancer <bob.dancer@compdance.com> wrote:
On progressives, the game I play
the most is 8/5 Bonus progressive, and I have almost all of the
breakpoints memorized at relevant levels.
---------------------------------
Yahoo! DSL Something to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
All the El Cortez $5 prog are too short pay to list. The others Sams
(8/5 Job, 9/6 Db, 8/5 ddb) 1s are as well.
Where are all of the $5 and up progressives? A quick glance of the
LV Index yields the following:
$5 BPAF - Binion's
$5 BP - Sam's Town, GVR
$5 JOB - Fiesta Rancho
I know that El Cortez has a $5 8/5 DDB prog that isn't listed in
the database. Has someone compiled a complete list? I'm aware of 5-
cards' list at http://videopoker.fws1.com/progressives.htm, but it
doesn't list $5 machines.
And Bob, do you care to divulge what those adjustments are to 8/5
BP? Or is that left as an exercise for us?
···
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, John <john_oc_ca@y...> wrote:
JohnBob Dancer <bob.dancer@c...> wrote:
On progressives, the game I play
the most is 8/5 Bonus progressive, and I have almost all of the
breakpoints memorized at relevant levels.---------------------------------
Yahoo! DSL Something to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
I wouldn't omit progressives such as the El Cortez 8/5 DDB just because they're short pay at reset - that's the way most progressives are. Eventually, they might become positive, either outright or by adding in point multipliers. This was the case with the El Cortez progressive recently. Perhaps someone on this list hit it?
Michael Boutot <vegas_iwish@yahoo.com> wrote: All the El Cortez $5 prog are too short pay to list. The others Sams
(8/5 Job, 9/6 Db, 8/5 ddb) 1s are as well.
Where are all of the $5 and up progressives? A quick glance of the
LV Index yields the following:
$5 BPAF - Binion's
$5 BP - Sam's Town, GVR
$5 JOB - Fiesta Rancho
I know that El Cortez has a $5 8/5 DDB prog that isn't listed in
the database. Has someone compiled a complete list? I'm aware of 5-
cards' list at http://videopoker.fws1.com/progressives.htm, but it
doesn't list $5 machines.
And Bob, do you care to divulge what those adjustments are to 8/5
BP? Or is that left as an exercise for us?
JohnBob Dancer <bob.dancer@c...> wrote:
On progressives, the game I play
the most is 8/5 Bonus progressive, and I have almost all of the
breakpoints memorized at relevant levels.---------------------------------
Yahoo! DSL Something to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
vpFREE Links: http://members.cox.net/vpfree/Links.htm
···
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, John <john_oc_ca@y...> wrote:
---------------------------------
YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
Visit your group "vpFREE" on the web.
To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
vpFREE-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
---------------------------------
---------------------------------
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Not reasonable to expect Administrator to post every progressive just
because may become positive after a large (& with 8/5 ddb, at $50k ev
only reaches 100.3%) increase.
I wouldn't omit progressives such as the El Cortez 8/5 DDB just
because they're short pay at reset - that's the way most progressives
are. Eventually, they might become positive, either outright or by
adding in point multipliers. This was the case with the El Cortez
progressive recently. Perhaps someone on this list hit it?
Michael Boutot <vegas_iwish@y...> wrote: All the El Cortez $5 prog
are too short pay to list. The others Sams
(8/5 Job, 9/6 Db, 8/5 ddb) 1s are as well.
>
> Where are all of the $5 and up progressives? A quick glance of
the
LV Index yields the following:
>
> $5 BPAF - Binion's
> $5 BP - Sam's Town, GVR
> $5 JOB - Fiesta Rancho
>
> I know that El Cortez has a $5 8/5 DDB prog that isn't listed
in
the database. Has someone compiled a complete list? I'm aware of 5-
cards' list at http://videopoker.fws1.com/progressives.htm, but it
doesn't list $5 machines.
>
> And Bob, do you care to divulge what those adjustments are to
8/5
BP?
>
> John
>
> Bob Dancer <bob.dancer@c...> wrote:
> On progressives, the game I play
> the most is 8/5 Bonus progressive, and I have almost all of the
> breakpoints memorized at relevant levels.
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Yahoo! DSL Something to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>vpFREE Links: http://members.cox.net/vpfree/Links.htm
---------------------------------
YAHOO! GROUPS LINKSVisit your group "vpFREE" on the web.
To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
vpFREE-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
Service.
···
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, John <john_oc_ca@y...> wrote:
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, John <john_oc_ca@y...> wrote:
---------------------------------
---------------------------------
Yahoo! Music Unlimited - Access over 1 million songs. Try it free.[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
As I see it, the purpose of the database is to list all of the machines in each casino that are anywhere close to being positive. In the case of progressives, one never knows how high they might go, and just because they have to go higher in one place than another is not a reason to omit them, in my opinion. Listing them in the database would serve the very useful purpose of helping someone find out where these progressives are, which I feel is the whole purpose of the database.
As with all machines, the value of a progressive can vary depending on other factors such as casback, point multipliers, and drawings. For example, El Cortez base cashback is .2%, and they often send out triple point coupons to locals. So the 8/5 DDB progressive is really never as bad as it's base return of 96.68%; for non-locals it's 96.88%, and with 3x points, adding .6% makes it 97.28% at reset (still awful, admittedly). A $50k royal makes the base return of 8/5 DDB 100.2%, but at El Cortez would be worth as much as 100.8% with triple points. I recently saw as high as $42.7k (99.32%), which is close to the break-even point of $43.6k. Granted, it still isn't positive but neither is regular 8/5 Bonus Poker, which is always listed in the database even for non-progressives, and isn't available at $5 at El Cortez. And this isn't even considering the value of drawing tickets.
So I therefore petition the administrator to list this and other such progressives in the database.
John
Not reasonable to expect Administrator to post every progressive just
because may become positive after a large (& with 8/5 ddb, at $50k ev
only reaches 100.3%) increase.
I wouldn't omit progressives such as the El Cortez 8/5 DDB just
because they're short pay at reset - that's the way most progressives
are. Eventually, they might become positive, either outright or by
adding in point multipliers. This was the case with the El Cortez
progressive recently. Perhaps someone on this list hit it?
Michael Boutot <vegas_iwish@y...> wrote: All the El Cortez $5 prog
are too short pay to list. The others Sams
(8/5 Job, 9/6 Db, 8/5 ddb) 1s are as well.
>
> Where are all of the $5 and up progressives? A quick glance of
the
LV Index yields the following:
>
> $5 BPAF - Binion's
> $5 BP - Sam's Town, GVR
> $5 JOB - Fiesta Rancho
>
> I know that El Cortez has a $5 8/5 DDB prog that isn't listed
in
the database. Has someone compiled a complete list? I'm aware of 5-
cards' list at http://videopoker.fws1.com/progressives.htm, but it
doesn't list $5 machines.
>
> And Bob, do you care to divulge what those adjustments are to
8/5
BP?
>
> John
>
> Bob Dancer <bob.dancer@c...> wrote:
> On progressives, the game I play
> the most is 8/5 Bonus progressive, and I have almost all of the
> breakpoints memorized at relevant levels.
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Yahoo! DSL Something to write home about. Just $16.99/mo. or less
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>vpFREE Links: http://members.cox.net/vpfree/Links.htm
---------------------------------
YAHOO! GROUPS LINKSVisit your group "vpFREE" on the web.
To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
vpFREE-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
Service.
---------------------------------
---------------------------------
Yahoo! Music Unlimited - Access over 1 million songs. Try it free.[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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···
Michael Boutot <vegas_iwish@yahoo.com> wrote:
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, John <john_oc_ca@y...> wrote:
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, John <john_oc_ca@y...> wrote:
---------------------------------
YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS
Visit your group "vpFREE" on the web.
To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
vpFREE-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
---------------------------------
---------------------------------
Yahoo! Music Unlimited - Access over 1 million songs. Try it free.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]