vpFREE2 Forums

(Fwd) Resorts East Chicago Inventory

Playing standard strategy for 9-6 DDB twos, threes or fours no low hit
every 2601 hands so every $13.01 on that meter is 0.1%.
twos, threes or fours with low every 6983 hands so every $34.92 on that
meter is 0.1%
four aces no low every 5761 hands so $28.81 is 0.1%
four aces with low every 16,235 hands so $81.18 is 0.1%
The two strategy changes likely to lower this occur when the royal is over
about $5,500 in that AT suited is better than A and AKQs, AKJs and AQJs,
are better than AA. The 3RFs that include a ten need to be slightly higher
to make this change. I might check this play out tomorrow but I have $55 in
coupons for MS and Trump. (The last rating period was awful for me at MS.)

···

[Original Message]
From: vp_nbi <nbi@wideopenwest.com>
To: <vpFREE_Chicago@yahoogroups.com>
Date: 6/4/2005 11:06:09 AM
Subject: [vpFREE_Chicago] Re: (Fwd) Resorts East Chicago Inventory

--- In vpFREE_Chicago@yahoogroups.com, "Chandler" <omnibibulous1@c...>
wrote:
> Remember the prog is DDB. It is upstairs along one wall of the
table games
> area. I recently talked to a EC regular who says they have been 9/6
for a
> while , but I remember them as 9/5. My memory often fools me, but it is
> definitely 9/6 now.

Thanks. I'll definitely check this out. Does anyone know what the
impact of metered quads is on the game's return? Running some paytable
calculations with frugal I discovered that the game becomes JOB like
in return at around 5100 coins (99.57 to be precise). That's
discounting any quad pays above baseline so it seems the game could be
playable below 5100 coins. As I'm unfamiliar with metered quads I have
no frame of reference for even attempting a guess as to their impact.
They could be metered in many different ways, unequal rates, partially
pegged to the jackpot, etc. Another question would be how often the
jackpot actually rises to 5100 coins. I know the Don & Mikes $1 bartop
rarely gets that high although it was $4900 the other day.

>
> Chandler
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: vpFREE_Chicago@yahoogroups.com
> [mailto:vpFREE_Chic…@…com]On Behalf Of vp_nbi
> Sent: Friday, June 03, 2005 3:08 PM
> To: vpFREE_Chicago@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [vpFREE_Chicago] Re: (Fwd) Resorts East Chicago Inventory
>
>
> — In vpFREE_Chicago@yahoogroups.com, "vpFREE" <vpFREE@C…> wrote:
> > Private email to vpFREE Administrator:
> >
> > ------- Forwarded message follows -------
> >
> > There have been some changes for the better. You now cannot throw a
> > rock without hitting some FPJB. Single play quarter and dollar
> > machines upstairs near the table games and in the lower level vp area.
> > There is also $JB in the bartops at the flair bar. Most of the
> > multigames that have the JB also contain 9/7 DB, 8/5 BP and 9/6 DDB.
> > So there is an awful lot of 99% and above inventory. I did not spot
> > any new NSUD.
> >
> > Unfortunately, multiplay and $5 inventory is still bad.
> >
> > The bank of uprights that contained the JB, NSUD and TB+ remain.
> >
> > The $ DDB prog with meters on royal and all the quads, previously
short
> > pay, is now 9/6.
>
> Thanks for your report. Where is the $1 progressive located? On my
> last visit I must have spaced out and walked right past it as I was
> intently looking for some positive Spin-Poker.
>
> >
> > I was not familiar with some of the more exotic paytable. I'll take
> > notes next visit. There may be something else playable there.
>
>
>
>
>
> vpFREE Links: http://members.cox.net/vpfree/Links.htm
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links

vpFREE Links: http://members.cox.net/vpfree/Links.htm

Yahoo! Groups Links

Thanks. Just out of curiosity how did you know the quads were metered
at .1% ? Did someone actually determine this or is .1% some sort of
standard for progressives featuring metered quads? It would be nice if
this info was on vpFree somewhere. I wonder how often the quad
jackpots rise to a level where they have a significant impact on the
game's overall return.

--- In vpFREE_Chicago@yahoogroups.com, "Howard Stern"
<howard.w.stern@e...> wrote:

Playing standard strategy for 9-6 DDB twos, threes or fours no low hit
every 2601 hands so every $13.01 on that meter is 0.1%.
twos, threes or fours with low every 6983 hands so every $34.92 on that
meter is 0.1%
four aces no low every 5761 hands so $28.81 is 0.1%
four aces with low every 16,235 hands so $81.18 is 0.1%
The two strategy changes likely to lower this occur when the royal

is over

about $5,500 in that AT suited is better than A and AKQs, AKJs and AQJs,
are better than AA. The 3RFs that include a ten need to be slightly

higher

to make this change. I might check this play out tomorrow but I have

$55 in

coupons for MS and Trump. (The last rating period was awful for me

at MS.)

> [Original Message]
> From: vp_nbi <nbi@w...>
> To: <vpFREE_Chicago@yahoogroups.com>
> Date: 6/4/2005 11:06:09 AM
> Subject: [vpFREE_Chicago] Re: (Fwd) Resorts East Chicago Inventory
>
> --- In vpFREE_Chicago@yahoogroups.com, "Chandler" <omnibibulous1@c...>
> wrote:
> > Remember the prog is DDB. It is upstairs along one wall of the
> table games
> > area. I recently talked to a EC regular who says they have been 9/6
> for a
> > while , but I remember them as 9/5. My memory often fools me,

but it is

> > definitely 9/6 now.
>
> Thanks. I'll definitely check this out. Does anyone know what the
> impact of metered quads is on the game's return? Running some paytable
> calculations with frugal I discovered that the game becomes JOB like
> in return at around 5100 coins (99.57 to be precise). That's
> discounting any quad pays above baseline so it seems the game could be
> playable below 5100 coins. As I'm unfamiliar with metered quads I have
> no frame of reference for even attempting a guess as to their impact.
> They could be metered in many different ways, unequal rates, partially
> pegged to the jackpot, etc. Another question would be how often the
> jackpot actually rises to 5100 coins. I know the Don & Mikes $1 bartop
> rarely gets that high although it was $4900 the other day.
>
> >
> > Chandler
> >
> > From: vpFREE_Chicago@yahoogroups.com
> > [mailto:vpFREE_Chic…@…com]On Behalf Of vp_nbi
> > Sent: Friday, June 03, 2005 3:08 PM
> > To: vpFREE_Chicago@yahoogroups.com
> > Subject: [vpFREE_Chicago] Re: (Fwd) Resorts East Chicago Inventory
> >
> >
> > > Private email to vpFREE Administrator:
> > >
> > > ------- Forwarded message follows -------
> > >
> > > There have been some changes for the better. You now cannot

throw a

> > > rock without hitting some FPJB. Single play quarter and dollar
> > > machines upstairs near the table games and in the lower level

vp area.

> > > There is also $JB in the bartops at the flair bar. Most of the
> > > multigames that have the JB also contain 9/7 DB, 8/5 BP and

9/6 DDB.

> > > So there is an awful lot of 99% and above inventory. I did

not spot

> > > any new NSUD.
> > >
> > > Unfortunately, multiplay and $5 inventory is still bad.
> > >
> > > The bank of uprights that contained the JB, NSUD and TB+ remain.
> > >
> > > The $ DDB prog with meters on royal and all the quads, previously
> short
> > > pay, is now 9/6.
> >
> > Thanks for your report. Where is the $1 progressive located? On my
> > last visit I must have spaced out and walked right past it as I was
> > intently looking for some positive Spin-Poker.
> >
> > >
> > > I was not familiar with some of the more exotic paytable.

I'll take

···

> > -----Original Message-----
> > --- In vpFREE_Chicago@yahoogroups.com, "vpFREE" <vpFREE@C...> wrote:
> > > notes next visit. There may be something else playable there.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > vpFREE Links: http://members.cox.net/vpfree/Links.htm
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
> vpFREE Links: http://members.cox.net/vpfree/Links.htm
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

I don't think he's talking about meter rate. I think what Howard has done
is created a way to determine ER including the quad royals, by determining a
value at which each quad meter increases total ER.

Chandler

···

-----Original Message-----
From: vpFREE_Chicago@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:vpFREE_Chic…@…com]On Behalf Of vp_nbi
Sent: Saturday, June 04, 2005 8:02 PM
To: vpFREE_Chicago@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [vpFREE_Chicago] Re: (Fwd) Resorts East Chicago Inventory

Thanks. Just out of curiosity how did you know the quads were metered
at .1% ? Did someone actually determine this or is .1% some sort of
standard for progressives featuring metered quads? It would be nice if
this info was on vpFree somewhere. I wonder how often the quad
jackpots rise to a level where they have a significant impact on the
game's overall return.

--- In vpFREE_Chicago@yahoogroups.com, "Howard Stern"
<howard.w.stern@e...> wrote:

Playing standard strategy for 9-6 DDB twos, threes or fours no low hit
every 2601 hands so every $13.01 on that meter is 0.1%.
twos, threes or fours with low every 6983 hands so every $34.92 on that
meter is 0.1%
four aces no low every 5761 hands so $28.81 is 0.1%
four aces with low every 16,235 hands so $81.18 is 0.1%
The two strategy changes likely to lower this occur when the royal

is over

about $5,500 in that AT suited is better than A and AKQs, AKJs and AQJs,
are better than AA. The 3RFs that include a ten need to be slightly

higher

to make this change. I might check this play out tomorrow but I have

$55 in

coupons for MS and Trump. (The last rating period was awful for me

at MS.)

> [Original Message]
> From: vp_nbi <nbi@w...>
> To: <vpFREE_Chicago@yahoogroups.com>
> Date: 6/4/2005 11:06:09 AM
> Subject: [vpFREE_Chicago] Re: (Fwd) Resorts East Chicago Inventory
>
> --- In vpFREE_Chicago@yahoogroups.com, "Chandler" <omnibibulous1@c...>
> wrote:
> > Remember the prog is DDB. It is upstairs along one wall of the
> table games
> > area. I recently talked to a EC regular who says they have been 9/6
> for a
> > while , but I remember them as 9/5. My memory often fools me,

but it is

> > definitely 9/6 now.
>
> Thanks. I'll definitely check this out. Does anyone know what the
> impact of metered quads is on the game's return? Running some paytable
> calculations with frugal I discovered that the game becomes JOB like
> in return at around 5100 coins (99.57 to be precise). That's
> discounting any quad pays above baseline so it seems the game could be
> playable below 5100 coins. As I'm unfamiliar with metered quads I have
> no frame of reference for even attempting a guess as to their impact.
> They could be metered in many different ways, unequal rates, partially
> pegged to the jackpot, etc. Another question would be how often the
> jackpot actually rises to 5100 coins. I know the Don & Mikes $1 bartop
> rarely gets that high although it was $4900 the other day.
>
> >
> > Chandler
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: vpFREE_Chicago@yahoogroups.com
> > [mailto:vpFREE_Chic…@…com]On Behalf Of vp_nbi
> > Sent: Friday, June 03, 2005 3:08 PM
> > To: vpFREE_Chicago@yahoogroups.com
> > Subject: [vpFREE_Chicago] Re: (Fwd) Resorts East Chicago Inventory
> >
> >
> > — In vpFREE_Chicago@yahoogroups.com, "vpFREE" <vpFREE@C…> wrote:
> > > Private email to vpFREE Administrator:
> > >
> > > ------- Forwarded message follows -------
> > >
> > > There have been some changes for the better. You now cannot

throw a

> > > rock without hitting some FPJB. Single play quarter and dollar
> > > machines upstairs near the table games and in the lower level

vp area.

> > > There is also $JB in the bartops at the flair bar. Most of the
> > > multigames that have the JB also contain 9/7 DB, 8/5 BP and

9/6 DDB.

> > > So there is an awful lot of 99% and above inventory. I did

not spot

> > > any new NSUD.
> > >
> > > Unfortunately, multiplay and $5 inventory is still bad.
> > >
> > > The bank of uprights that contained the JB, NSUD and TB+ remain.
> > >
> > > The $ DDB prog with meters on royal and all the quads, previously
> short
> > > pay, is now 9/6.
> >
> > Thanks for your report. Where is the $1 progressive located? On my
> > last visit I must have spaced out and walked right past it as I was
> > intently looking for some positive Spin-Poker.
> >
> > >
> > > I was not familiar with some of the more exotic paytable.

I'll take

> > > notes next visit. There may be something else playable there.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > vpFREE Links: http://members.cox.net/vpfree/Links.htm
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
> vpFREE Links: http://members.cox.net/vpfree/Links.htm
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

vpFREE Links: http://members.cox.net/vpfree/Links.htm

Yahoo! Groups Links

Last rating period? I thought you did ok for BB this month.

Chandler

···

-----Original Message-----
From: vpFREE_Chicago@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:vpFREE_Chic…@…com]On Behalf Of Howard Stern
Sent: Saturday, June 04, 2005 5:34 PM
To: vpFREE_Chicago@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [vpFREE_Chicago] Re: (Fwd) Resorts East Chicago Inventory

Playing standard strategy for 9-6 DDB twos, threes or fours no low hit
every 2601 hands so every $13.01 on that meter is 0.1%.
twos, threes or fours with low every 6983 hands so every $34.92 on that
meter is 0.1%
four aces no low every 5761 hands so $28.81 is 0.1%
four aces with low every 16,235 hands so $81.18 is 0.1%
The two strategy changes likely to lower this occur when the royal is over
about $5,500 in that AT suited is better than A and AKQs, AKJs and AQJs,
are better than AA. The 3RFs that include a ten need to be slightly higher
to make this change. I might check this play out tomorrow but I have $55 in
coupons for MS and Trump. (The last rating period was awful for me at MS.)

[Original Message]
From: vp_nbi <nbi@wideopenwest.com>
To: <vpFREE_Chicago@yahoogroups.com>
Date: 6/4/2005 11:06:09 AM
Subject: [vpFREE_Chicago] Re: (Fwd) Resorts East Chicago Inventory

--- In vpFREE_Chicago@yahoogroups.com, "Chandler" <omnibibulous1@c...>
wrote:
> Remember the prog is DDB. It is upstairs along one wall of the
table games
> area. I recently talked to a EC regular who says they have been 9/6
for a
> while , but I remember them as 9/5. My memory often fools me, but it is
> definitely 9/6 now.

Thanks. I'll definitely check this out. Does anyone know what the
impact of metered quads is on the game's return? Running some paytable
calculations with frugal I discovered that the game becomes JOB like
in return at around 5100 coins (99.57 to be precise). That's
discounting any quad pays above baseline so it seems the game could be
playable below 5100 coins. As I'm unfamiliar with metered quads I have
no frame of reference for even attempting a guess as to their impact.
They could be metered in many different ways, unequal rates, partially
pegged to the jackpot, etc. Another question would be how often the
jackpot actually rises to 5100 coins. I know the Don & Mikes $1 bartop
rarely gets that high although it was $4900 the other day.

>
> Chandler
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: vpFREE_Chicago@yahoogroups.com
> [mailto:vpFREE_Chic…@…com]On Behalf Of vp_nbi
> Sent: Friday, June 03, 2005 3:08 PM
> To: vpFREE_Chicago@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [vpFREE_Chicago] Re: (Fwd) Resorts East Chicago Inventory
>
>
> — In vpFREE_Chicago@yahoogroups.com, "vpFREE" <vpFREE@C…> wrote:
> > Private email to vpFREE Administrator:
> >
> > ------- Forwarded message follows -------
> >
> > There have been some changes for the better. You now cannot throw a
> > rock without hitting some FPJB. Single play quarter and dollar
> > machines upstairs near the table games and in the lower level vp area.
> > There is also $JB in the bartops at the flair bar. Most of the
> > multigames that have the JB also contain 9/7 DB, 8/5 BP and 9/6 DDB.
> > So there is an awful lot of 99% and above inventory. I did not spot
> > any new NSUD.
> >
> > Unfortunately, multiplay and $5 inventory is still bad.
> >
> > The bank of uprights that contained the JB, NSUD and TB+ remain.
> >
> > The $ DDB prog with meters on royal and all the quads, previously
short
> > pay, is now 9/6.
>
> Thanks for your report. Where is the $1 progressive located? On my
> last visit I must have spaced out and walked right past it as I was
> intently looking for some positive Spin-Poker.
>
> >
> > I was not familiar with some of the more exotic paytable. I'll take
> > notes next visit. There may be something else playable there.
>
>
>
>
>
> vpFREE Links: http://members.cox.net/vpfree/Links.htm
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links

vpFREE Links: http://members.cox.net/vpfree/Links.htm

Yahoo! Groups Links

vpFREE Links: http://members.cox.net/vpfree/Links.htm

Yahoo! Groups Links

--- In vpFREE_Chicago@yahoogroups.com, "Chandler" <omnibibulous1@c...>
wrote:

I don't think he's talking about meter rate. I think what Howard

has done

is created a way to determine ER including the quad royals, by

determining a

value at which each quad meter increases total ER.

No.

Lets go through an example using Howard's numbers.
Suppose 4 deuces w/o kicker has just been hit, i.e. quad meter reset.
The cycle for this quad is 2601 hands which amounts to 13005 (2601 x
5) in coin in. At the .1% rate this amounts to $13.01. This means that
for every cycle worth of hands (2601) $13.01 is set aside for this
quad progressive. The math is simple, the question I have is where the
.1% comes from.

Obviously *any* quad meter value contributes to the ER, so the comment
"determining a value at which each quad meter increases total ER" is
like saying frozen ice. Furthermore, the metering rate need not be the
same. It could for example be based on the cycle or be pegged to the
RF jackpot. My guess is that there simply is a set of common rates for
which a precedent has been set and is widely utilized. Local
jurisdiction gaming law may also play a role.

Chandler

From: vpFREE_Chicago@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:vpFREE_Chic…@…com]On Behalf Of vp_nbi
Sent: Saturday, June 04, 2005 8:02 PM
To: vpFREE_Chicago@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [vpFREE_Chicago] Re: (Fwd) Resorts East Chicago Inventory

Thanks. Just out of curiosity how did you know the quads were metered
at .1% ? Did someone actually determine this or is .1% some sort of
standard for progressives featuring metered quads? It would be nice if
this info was on vpFree somewhere. I wonder how often the quad
jackpots rise to a level where they have a significant impact on the
game's overall return.

--- In vpFREE_Chicago@yahoogroups.com, "Howard Stern"
<howard.w.stern@e...> wrote:
> Playing standard strategy for 9-6 DDB twos, threes or fours no low hit
> every 2601 hands so every $13.01 on that meter is 0.1%.
> twos, threes or fours with low every 6983 hands so every $34.92

on that

> meter is 0.1%
> four aces no low every 5761 hands so $28.81 is 0.1%
> four aces with low every 16,235 hands so $81.18 is 0.1%
> The two strategy changes likely to lower this occur when the royal
is over
> about $5,500 in that AT suited is better than A and AKQs, AKJs and

AQJs,

> are better than AA. The 3RFs that include a ten need to be slightly
higher
> to make this change. I might check this play out tomorrow but I have
$55 in
> coupons for MS and Trump. (The last rating period was awful for me
at MS.)
>
>
> > [Original Message]
> > From: vp_nbi <nbi@w...>
> > To: <vpFREE_Chicago@yahoogroups.com>
> > Date: 6/4/2005 11:06:09 AM
> > Subject: [vpFREE_Chicago] Re: (Fwd) Resorts East Chicago Inventory
> >
> > --- In vpFREE_Chicago@yahoogroups.com, "Chandler"

<omnibibulous1@c...>

> > wrote:
> > > Remember the prog is DDB. It is upstairs along one wall of the
> > table games
> > > area. I recently talked to a EC regular who says they have

been 9/6

> > for a
> > > while , but I remember them as 9/5. My memory often fools me,
but it is
> > > definitely 9/6 now.
> >
> > Thanks. I'll definitely check this out. Does anyone know what the
> > impact of metered quads is on the game's return? Running some

paytable

> > calculations with frugal I discovered that the game becomes JOB like
> > in return at around 5100 coins (99.57 to be precise). That's
> > discounting any quad pays above baseline so it seems the game

could be

> > playable below 5100 coins. As I'm unfamiliar with metered quads

I have

> > no frame of reference for even attempting a guess as to their

impact.

> > They could be metered in many different ways, unequal rates,

partially

> > pegged to the jackpot, etc. Another question would be how often the
> > jackpot actually rises to 5100 coins. I know the Don & Mikes $1

bartop

> > rarely gets that high although it was $4900 the other day.
> >
> > >
> > > Chandler
> > >
> > > From: vpFREE_Chicago@yahoogroups.com
> > > [mailto:vpFREE_Chic…@…com]On Behalf Of vp_nbi
> > > Sent: Friday, June 03, 2005 3:08 PM
> > > To: vpFREE_Chicago@yahoogroups.com
> > > Subject: [vpFREE_Chicago] Re: (Fwd) Resorts East Chicago Inventory
> > >
> > >
> > > — In vpFREE_Chicago@yahoogroups.com, "vpFREE" <vpFREE@C…>

wrote:

> > > > Private email to vpFREE Administrator:
> > > >
> > > > ------- Forwarded message follows -------
> > > >
> > > > There have been some changes for the better. You now cannot
throw a
> > > > rock without hitting some FPJB. Single play quarter and dollar
> > > > machines upstairs near the table games and in the lower level
vp area.
> > > > There is also $JB in the bartops at the flair bar. Most of the
> > > > multigames that have the JB also contain 9/7 DB, 8/5 BP and
9/6 DDB.
> > > > So there is an awful lot of 99% and above inventory. I did
not spot
> > > > any new NSUD.
> > > >
> > > > Unfortunately, multiplay and $5 inventory is still bad.
> > > >
> > > > The bank of uprights that contained the JB, NSUD and TB+ remain.
> > > >
> > > > The $ DDB prog with meters on royal and all the quads,

previously

> > short
> > > > pay, is now 9/6.
> > >
> > > Thanks for your report. Where is the $1 progressive located? On my
> > > last visit I must have spaced out and walked right past it as

I was

···

-----Original Message-----
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > intently looking for some positive Spin-Poker.
> > >
> > > >
> > > > I was not familiar with some of the more exotic paytable.
I'll take
> > > > notes next visit. There may be something else playable there.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > vpFREE Links: http://members.cox.net/vpfree/Links.htm
> > >
> > > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > vpFREE Links: http://members.cox.net/vpfree/Links.htm
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >

vpFREE Links: http://members.cox.net/vpfree/Links.htm

Yahoo! Groups Links

Poor wording on my part. Try, "determining a value at which each quad meter
contributes to ER by .1." IOW Every increase of x value for a given quad
increases er by .1 You could then determine er,including the current values
for all quads, at any time. It is entirely possible that I am wrong. I
usually leave the number crunching to others. For some of us the math is
never easy.

Chandler

···

-----Original Message-----
From: vpFREE_Chicago@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:vpFREE_Chic…@…com]On Behalf Of vp_nbi
Sent: Saturday, June 04, 2005 11:45 PM
To: vpFREE_Chicago@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [vpFREE_Chicago] Re: (Fwd) Resorts East Chicago Inventory

Obviously *any* quad meter value contributes to the ER, so the comment
"determining a value at which each quad meter increases total ER" is
like saying frozen ice.