vpFREE2 Forums

FW: Riviera offer

#1

I received a $200 SLOTFSP offer from Riviera. The offer states that you have to stay for 2 nights min on selected nigths to get the freeplay. I called up and tried to book for 1/8 and 1/9 and was told the rooms would be $30/night plus $3.50/night energy surcharge and a $15 cancellation fee once I booked, regardless of when I cancel. I declined the offer.

That is the first time I have received a sizable free play offer that required a stay AND required you to pay for the rooms.

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#2

John wrote: I received a $200 SLOTFSP offer from Riviera. The offer
states that you have to stay for 2 nights min on selected nigths to get
the freeplay. I called up and tried to book for 1/8 and 1/9 and was
told the rooms would be $30/night plus $3.50/night energy surcharge and
a $15 cancellation fee once I booked, regardless of when I cancel. I
declined the offer.
That is the first time I have received a sizable free play offer that
required a stay AND required you to pay for the rooms.

Why did you decline the offer? Would you have accepted it if the bonus
was $125 and the room was free? Seems to me receiving $200, but having
to pay $67 for the room is a better offer than that.

Bob Dancer

For the best in video poker information, visit www.bobdancer.com
or call 1-800-244-2224 M-F 9-5 Pacific Time.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

#3

Since I do not play at the Riviera, I may be incorrect in my
assumption, that the FSP had some other attendant restrictions.

In many casinos you can only use FSP on "selected" slot machines,
NOT including VP. In other casinos you are restricted to non-FP VP.
In almost all casinos, you must play the SFP through a machine at
least once, prior to cashing out.

In any of the above instances, I do NOT consider FSP to be the
equivilant of cash! Perhaps John feels the same way.

Just my opinion of course.

-Babe-

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================================================
John wrote: I received a $200 SLOTFSP offer from Riviera. The
offer states that you have to stay for 2 nights min on selected
nigths to get the freeplay. I called up and tried to book for 1/8
and 1/9 and was told the rooms would be $30/night plus $3.50/night
energy surcharge and a $15 cancellation fee once I booked,
regardless of when I cancel. I declined the offer............

In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Bob Dancer" <bob.dancer@c...> wrote:
Why did you decline the offer? Would you have accepted it if the
bonus was $125 and the room was free? Seems to me receiving $200,
but having to pay $67 for the room is a better offer than that.
Bob Dancer

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

#4

Babe said: I do NOT consider FSP to be the equivilant of cash!

Assuming you mean "free slot play", how much WOULD you consider $200 of
FSP worth? Even playing "only" 8/5 Bonus, it's worth more than $198 ---
and at some casinos you get slot club points in addition to this. If you
want to add a discount rate because you HAVE to play it through once,
fine. But surely you don't think $200 of FSP is worth zero, do you? And
it's not like gambling at video poker isn't something that everyone here
is willing and able to do anyway. And if it's worth more than zero, my
philosophy is that I put a reasonably-accurate number on it to help me
choose between alternatives.

I value it at "close enough to $200" to be able to use that figure if I
have to choose whether to take THIS offer in Las Vegas or THAT offer
somewhere else (assuming I can't do both.) (The only purpose, to me, of
a preliminary estimate is to figure out whether the deal is worth doing
or not. I KNOW the actual result will be different than my estimate, but
an estimate is the best information available beforehand.) If running it
through once is so distasteful to you that you value you at only, say,
$180, that's a personal choice and you're welcome to it. But give it a
value --- and go forward with the decision-making process.

My earlier post to John suggested that the total value of this
particular deal would probably be enough to make it worth his while ---
although I certainly don't know what other offers John is contemplating
or what his "minimum standards" are. I was suggesting he "rephrase" the
offer, and not get hung up on the fact that he's paying for a room. His
earlier post sounded like it was a matter of principle for him to not
pay for the room --- although I certainly may have misunderstood what he
wrote. Merely delete the price of the room from the offer and consider
whether it's a good enough deal or not.

Bob Dancer

For the best in video poker information, visit www.bobdancer.com
or call 1-800-244-2224 M-F 9-5 Pacific Time.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

#5

Thanks for your reply, Bob. I appreciate the time you took to
explain your thoughts and calculations.

···

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Babe wrote: I do NOT consider FSP to be the equivilant of cash.

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Bob Dancer" <bob.dancer@c...> wrote:

Assuming you mean "free slot play", how much WOULD you consider $200
of FSP worth?

It would depend entirely on the casino which offered the FP.

For example, the El Cortez permits FP ONLY on slot machines. VP is
exluded from FP. Since I do not play slot machines, this offer is
worth considerably less to me even assuming the slot payback is 95%,
in the long term. I will certainly not play a slot machine to any
possible "long term" conclusion.

The Golden Nugget, conversely, permits FP on all their machines,
including their best pay schedule VP. Of course this offer would be
considerably more attractive to me, even though their vp inventory
is not as favorable.

The Peppermill, in Reno, allows FP on most VP, but excludes FPDW.
If I was planning to play 10/7DB or 10/6/40DDB, this offer would
appeal to me.

I guess that, as long as we could both agree that FP is NOT the same
as CB or BBC, due to various restrictions in it's usuage, which are
imposed by the casino, that we are actually on the same page.

......... But surely you don't think $200 of FSP is worth zero, do
you?

Absolutely not! I enjoy FP offers, and take advantage of them when
I can do so. As a matter of fact, though I live in the Chicago area,
I have frequently planned trips to Nevada based on FP offers.

And it's not like gambling at video poker isn't something that
everyone here is willing and able to do anyway. And if it's worth
more than zero, my philosophy is that I put a reasonably-accurate
number on it to help me choose between alternatives.

I think that this is very sensible, and I would completely agree.

If running it through once is so distasteful to you that you value
you at only, say, $180, that's a personal choice and you're welcome
to it. But give it a value --- and go forward with the decision-
making process.

Though "running it through once" is not "distasteful" to me, I do
still do feel that this provision lessens the value of the offer, as
compared to unrestricted CB.

............ I was suggesting he (John) "rephrase" the offer, and
not get hung up on the fact that he's paying for a room. His
earlier post sounded like it was a matter of principle for him to
not pay for the room...........

I can certainly understand your logic here. On the other hand, not
having paid for a room in Nevada in many years, I also can relate to
John's feelings. Though it may be, as you phrase it, "a hang-up". I
believe that many of us would sympathize with John's annoyance. Why
irritate a customer whom you are trying to lure into your casino
with a nice offer. If the casino throws in the room charge as well
(not even considering the absurd "energy sur-charge") the customer
will probably happily accept the offer.

Thanks again for your informed comments.
-Babe-

#6

Bob Dancer wrote:

Babe said: I do NOT consider FSP to be the equivilant of cash!

Assuming you mean "free slot play", how much WOULD you consider $200
of FSP worth? Even playing "only" 8/5 Bonus, it's worth more than
$198. If you want to add a discount rate because you HAVE to play it
through once, fine. But surely you don't think $200 of FSP is worth
zero, do you? And if it's worth more than zero, my philosophy is
that I put a reasonably-accurate number on it to help me choose
between alternatives.

I suspect Babe is closer to being on your wavelength than may have
seemed on first reading, Bob -- possibly closer than what she perceives.

From the context of her full message it's clear that she intends FSP
be discounted appropriately - not entirely negated. And she appears
to be reasonably cautious in selecting a discount, recognizing that
some restrictions (such as non-vp play only for FSP) should be
weighted considerably more than the < 1% you'd advise in your example.

I'd apply a 20% discount rate if it had to be played through non-vp
slots. The true ER might be something like 92%, but I'd exclude the
jackpot value, which can represent as much as 10% of the play return.

- Harry

#7

Looks like Babe and I are both "at it" this morning. Wasn't trying to
step on your reply, Babe ... you just got it in while I was drafting
mine (I was pulled away for awhile).

- H.

#8

Hello friend Harry,

It's nice to chat with you this morning.

I have an excuse for being up before the Roosters are even thinking
of crowing. I am still a bit jet-lagged, having just returned from
2
weeks in Tunisia, where, I can attest, it is not only 7 hours later
than in my Central Time Zone, but that they have abominable VP!

I know that you're in the Eastern Time Zone, but you're still up
very VERY early.......not, however, early enough to beat old Babe to
the answer!

Thanks for the back-up!

Best regards,
-Babe-

···

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--In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Harry Porter" <harry.porter@v...>
wrote:

Looks like Babe and I are both "at it" this morning. Wasn't trying
to
step on your reply, Babe ... you just got it in while I was drafting
mine (I was pulled away for awhile).

- H.