vpFREE2 Forums

FREEvpFREE

Yesterday I deleted a post on vpFREE and reposted it on FREEvpFREE.
Although the post was objective in nature and politely presented, it was
IMO a negative personal post. As such, it was appropriate for posting and
discussing on FREEvpFREE, but not on vpFREE.

Negative personal posts aren't tolerated on vpFREE because they usually
aren't necessary when discussing an issue, have very little to do with our
primary reason for being, and they practically always result in a disruptive
environment that complicates and darkens my day.

FREEvpFREE is appropriate for any negative personal posts and is
available for extended discussions of off-topic or disruptive subjects. In an
effort to encourage greater use of FREEvpFREE, I'm going to start posting
weekly listings of active FREEvpFREE threads on vpFREE.

vpFREE Administrator

There is a fine line here. As a writer myself, I may look at it differently
but here is my take:

When I write something that appears in print or online, something that the
public can read, I feel that I am "fair game" for public criticism, positive
or negative, about what I have written. I think the courts have made
clear rulings on this issue. You can disagree with what I say. I can
respond and defend my point of view. We can go back and forth
indefinitely - although when you do that on an Internet list, you are boring
a lot of people!

However, if my writing (and other activities, like being on TV, speaking,
etc.) has made me a "public figure," then the issue becomes a little less
clear. And you see movie stars and other big public figures taking this to
court quite frequently when they think that revelations or criticism is
unjust, untrue, or libelous.

On Internet lists, the "rules of conduct" probably should be more a matter
of fairness, good taste, and good manners rather than a matter of legality.
But since all these have extremely varied individual interpretations, this
area is VERY murky. This is where the Administrator has to make judgments -
not an easy job by any means. But I would never want him/her to restrict
someone's privilege to post - or take their post to FREEvpFREE - because
they disagreed strongly about something I wrote in Frugal Fridays or in one
of my books, particularly if they exactly quoted the part that they were
disagreeing about. By quoting (rather than paraphrasing which can change
the author's original meaning), this gives others the information they need
to decide whether they agree or disagree.

It is very hard to separate the message from the messenger. Personally, I
feel that my writings do reveal my character. To give an extreme example,
if I state that I am a thief, a liar, a killer, a cheater, or
describe things that I have done that would come under negative categories
like these, I feel you the reader have every right to think less of me and
my character if you wish and respond to those writings in a way that shows you do not
approve of that type of behavior. Whether you transfer that opinion to my
writings and decide to reject them, is your choice. There have been
criminals who have written something worthwhile - a cat burglar who writes
about how he picks his victim's houses might give you useful information
about how to protect yourself from this type of crime.

An aside: Actually, this judging of character goes on all the time on the
Internet, especially in forums. We are ALL being judged by our words.
There are many people on this list that I have never seen, don't have any
outside information about them - all I know about them is what their posts
say and how they say it. I try not to be a judgmental person but I can not
help unconsciously making judgments and evaluations all the time. Most of
you I would really like to meet - you sound like very fair and reasonable
persons. Sad to say, there are a few people that I would never make an
effort to get to know better, yea, I might take deliberate measures to avoid
meeting you. It has always amazed me that some people will say impolite,
harsh, even mean things in a post than I don't believe they would ever say
in person. I think people aren't as "hidden" on the Internet as they like
to feel that they are. Words are VERY revealing.

I would hope that this list would not stifle free idea interchange, whether
the people involved are "famous" or not. I think we all can contribute to
this goal (and help out the Administrator) by striving to be more polite in
our tone. I find that it helps me write calmer, more reasonable posts if I
don't hit the Send button immediately after I write something. Writing in
the heat of the moment is always dangerous. Go away from the post for an
hour and then come back - and read it like you didn't know the poster. When
I do that, I find I usually have to make some changes so the post sounds
more like it is from a "reasonable" person!!!

···

________________________________________
Jean $�ott - http://www.FrugalGambler.biz
  for VP software and strategy cards.
  NEW - Blackjack Strategy Cards +
              Updated Second Edition of
             "The Frugal Gambler."

Jean Scott wrote:

I would hope that this list would not stifle free idea interchange,
whether the people involved are "famous" or not.

Ditto. However, speaking for myself, a discussion of the ethics of
ANY individual isn't good fodder here. Because of the intensity of
emotions often involved and there usually aren't objective standards
that all participants equally accept, the ensuing discussion has a far
greater potential to become disruptive and constructive.

FREEvpFREE has been designated as an alternate forum to handle any
discussion that might detract from the primary purpose of this group.
It's only appropriate that some discussion might be redirected there
and doing so need not stifle discussion in any respect, so long as the
forum proves interesting enough that people are motivated to follow it
in addition to this one.

- Harry

--- In FREEvpFREE@yahoogroups.com, vpFREE Administrator <vp_free@y...>
wrote:

FREEvpFREE is appropriate for any negative personal posts and is

available for extended discussions of off-topic or disruptive
subjects.>>>

Can we change "negative personal posts" to "critical posts" I don't
think there is large demand for a mud slinging forum. Having a forum
where ideas can be aggressively argued would be welcomed. I think the
criteria for what is considered personal is different for public
figures, especially those who write about their personal lives. I
thought "Jean" did a good job in discussing this on vpFree.

In an effort to encourage greater use of FREEvpFREE, I'm going to

start posting weekly listings of active FREEvpFREE threads on vpFREE.>>>

I applaud this initiative.