vpFREE2 Forums

Either Way Royals VP Machine

#1

In a message dated 1/30/08 11:39:16 AM US Mountain Standard Time,
BANDSTAND54@AOL.COM writes:

···

Howdy

On a tip I found two of the above flat top machines at The Borgata in AC.
They are in the vicinity of The Amphora Lounge. They offer .50 and 1.00
games.
9/6 JB is one of them.

If you get an A K Q J 1O 0r 1O J Q K A royal you are rewarded an extra 1000
credits. I did not know they were available or existed...especially in AC.

Grumpy

****
Southern Nevada has such beasts, but they are usually a 50,000 coin payoff or
a sequential progressive, not a flat 1000 credit bonus.

You can arrange 5 cards in 120 specific ways so 2 out of 120 royals are
sequential royals. Getting an extra 1000 credits once in every 60 royals is not
that much of a deal.

The Golden Nugget used to (maybe still does) have a sequential called
"Royalmania". I do believe it was on a DB 9/7/5 base game (used to be Bonus 8/5).

The Golden Nugget-Laughlin currently has a quarter version of Royalmania on
Bonus 8/5 that resets at $10k (used to be $15k).

Bob Dancer's Casinogaming Column (April 3, 2000) talks up sequential royals
in Vegas and puts .4% value at 50,000 coins as a starting point.

I have seen the GN-Vegas one over $30k and GN-L over $23k, but that was in
the good old days.

Bluestreak

<BR><BR>**************<BR>Start the year off right. Easy ways to stay in shape.<BR>
http://body.aol.com/fitness/winter-exercise?NCID=aolcmp00300000002489</HTML>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

#2

At Sam's Town in Las Vegas on Boulder Hwy, there are several banks of
sequential royals. There is a quarter one with back to back machines
near the bathroom by the Winchester Bar, and 5c machines in that low
roller area near the entrance to the atrium.

#3

Peppermill Reno has a bank of 5 machines with a prog RF and a
SEQUENTIAL RF flat payoff of 50,000 coins ($12,500). The game is 25c
8/5 BP. Dreaming of the sequential has got me looking for one, two and
three to the RF in sequential position on the deal, something to keep
my mind active on an otherwise rudimentary VP game. (the 4RF and dealt
Seq RF are obvious holds) But it got me to wondering:

Does the SEQUENTIAL PAY OUT in both DIRECTIONS?

-AND-

WHO in the casino can TELL ME the definitive ANSWER?

I've tried many ways so far to get an answer:
(1) I've read the words on the machine and the help/paytable screen.
    [ no answer shown ]

(2) I've asked slot attendants and a slot managers.
    [ they did not know for sure and they gave conflicting opinions. ]

(3) I read the article in message #78401 about the woman who got a
Sequential but was not paid off. the casino maintained her Sequential
was in the wrong direction. She sued and won: Wrong way sequential
lawsuit: http://tinyurl.com/2dseto
    [ I don't feel any better that I'd have to sue if I get a
"wrong-way" Sequential ]

(4) One old geezer local at this 25c BP w/SeqRF remembers when the
Sequential was hit- over 4 yrs ago and he didn't know the direction.

So, being that it DOES affect my hold strategies to know which way or
ways the SEQ RF pays off, what do YOU recommend I do to get the answer??

Thanks for your opinion!

~MARK

<snip>

****
Southern Nevada has such beasts, but they are usually a 50,000 coin
payoff or a sequential progressive, not a flat 1000 credit bonus.

<snip>

···

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, GRAYTLEEGRAY@... wrote:

Bob Dancer's Casinogaming Column (April 3, 2000)talks up sequential
royals in Vegas and puts .4% value at 50,000 coins as a starting
point.
<snip>
Bluestreak

#4

They also have them for 50 cents and I believe in $'s
too. They are all short pay and should be avoided.

Regards
A.P.

···

--- Robert Levine <stuckinvegas@yahoo.com> wrote:

At Sam's Town in Las Vegas on Boulder Hwy, there are
several banks of
sequential royals. There is a quarter one with back
to back machines
near the bathroom by the Winchester Bar, and 5c
machines in that low
roller area near the entrance to the atrium.

#5

So, being that it DOES affect my hold strategies to know which way or
ways the SEQ RF pays off, what do YOU recommend I do to get the

answer??

Thanks for your opinion!

If you actually hit a sequential royal while playing a machine with a
sequential royal bonus, my guess is the casino will refuse to pay
anyway, since that seems to be the latest trick, to contest large
payoffs. Wizard has even started a blog on the topic:

http://wizardofodds.com/casinos/vegasblacklist.html

In Nevada, a casino is supposed to immediately contact Gaming which is
available 24/7, don't buy the casino claim that Gaming isn't open on
weekends or after hours, etc. Still, they probably will not, but the
good news is that you can contact Gaming yourself, wizard has provided
the numbers above. You need to do that right then, not the next day or
next week. If you walk from the casino instead of contesting, you are
to some degree agreeing with the casino, especially if you accept
their offered payoff. As long as there is nothing stated about forward
or reverse or suited sequential royals, a sequential royal is any of
the above. The other trick to watch out for is a stated limit on the
machine, fine print that says something like max jackpot payoff is $X.
Casinos use this as an excuse not to pay off big jackpots. If the
situation is straightforward and clearly illegal on the casino's part,
Gaming will probably rule in your favor and force the casino to pay in
full. Otherwise Gaming of course sides with the casino. You can
contest the Gaming officer's ruling, and you might get a Gaming board
hearing, otherwise your only recourse is the court system. Read
Nersesian's "Beat the Players", it's got all the details.

···

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Mark" <mark_my_words_again@...> wrote:

#6

Regarding the Wizard's "Black List" article....

Currently, all that's posted is a story about the Stratosphere refusing
to honor an expired ticket. That has nothing to do with a casino
contesting (refusing to pay) a large jackpot.

I doubt that the Strat is contesting that the ticket was a winner.
They are just saying that, rightfully so, the ticket is no longer valid.

"....that seems to be the latest trick, to contest large payoffs."

What other recent stories or news substantiates a statement like
this (avoiding large payoffs is the casinos' latest trick)?

···

On 2/1/08, nightoftheiguana2000 <nightoftheiguana2000@yahoo.com> wrote:

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Mark" <mark_my_words_again@...> wrote:
> So, being that it DOES affect my hold strategies to know which way or
> ways the SEQ RF pays off, what do YOU recommend I do to get the
answer??
>
> Thanks for your opinion!

If you actually hit a sequential royal while playing a machine with a
sequential royal bonus, my guess is the casino will refuse to pay
anyway, since that seems to be the latest trick, to contest large
payoffs. Wizard has even started a blog on the topic:

http://wizardofodds.com/casinos/vegasblacklist.html

In Nevada, a casino is supposed to immediately contact Gaming which is
available 24/7, don't buy the casino claim that Gaming isn't open on
weekends or after hours, etc. Still, they probably will not, but the
good news is that you can contact Gaming yourself, wizard has provided
the numbers above. You need to do that right then, not the next day or
next week. If you walk from the casino instead of contesting, you are
to some degree agreeing with the casino, especially if you accept
their offered payoff. As long as there is nothing stated about forward
or reverse or suited sequential royals, a sequential royal is any of
the above. The other trick to watch out for is a stated limit on the
machine, fine print that says something like max jackpot payoff is $X.
Casinos use this as an excuse not to pay off big jackpots. If the
situation is straightforward and clearly illegal on the casino's part,
Gaming will probably rule in your favor and force the casino to pay in
full. Otherwise Gaming of course sides with the casino. You can
contest the Gaming officer's ruling, and you might get a Gaming board
hearing, otherwise your only recourse is the court system. Read
Nersesian's "Beat the Players", it's got all the details.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

#7

<<Currently, all that's posted is a story about the Stratosphere refusing
to honor an expired ticket. That has nothing to do with a casino
contesting (refusing to pay) a large jackpot.

I doubt that the Strat is contesting that the ticket was a winner.
They are just saying that, rightfully so, the ticket is no longer valid.>>

He won the bet. They owe him the money. There's nothing "rightful" about not
paying it. Welshing on bets because the winner waited too long to come
collect is not a suitable way for a casino to do business.

Cogno

#8

I doubt that the Strat is contesting that the ticket was a winner.
They are just saying that, rightfully so, the ticket is no longer valid

I have on occasion waited longer than six months for Terrible's to deposit my VP markers. Should I stop payment on them on the theory they are no longer "valid" and Terribles waited too long to collect their "winnings"? Sounds like the same reasoning the Strat is using.

Stratosphere owes the man his money. It would be easy to argue that 60 days is not a "reasonable time" for a laches limitation on collection of debts.

Dave

#9

Good Info. I have gotten a sequential royal (only was not playing a
special bonus machine when I did). I often wondered if I would ever
get another one - and maybe I should play those special ones.

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "nightoftheiguana2000"
<nightoftheiguana2000@...> wrote:

> So, being that it DOES affect my hold strategies to know which

way or

> ways the SEQ RF pays off, what do YOU recommend I do to get the
answer??
>
> Thanks for your opinion!

If you actually hit a sequential royal while playing a machine with

a

sequential royal bonus, my guess is the casino will refuse to pay
anyway, since that seems to be the latest trick, to contest large
payoffs. Wizard has even started a blog on the topic:

http://wizardofodds.com/casinos/vegasblacklist.html

In Nevada, a casino is supposed to immediately contact Gaming which

is

available 24/7, don't buy the casino claim that Gaming isn't open on
weekends or after hours, etc. Still, they probably will not, but the
good news is that you can contact Gaming yourself, wizard has

provided

the numbers above. You need to do that right then, not the next day

or

next week. If you walk from the casino instead of contesting, you

are

to some degree agreeing with the casino, especially if you accept
their offered payoff. As long as there is nothing stated about

forward

or reverse or suited sequential royals, a sequential royal is any of
the above. The other trick to watch out for is a stated limit on the
machine, fine print that says something like max jackpot payoff is

$X.

Casinos use this as an excuse not to pay off big jackpots. If the
situation is straightforward and clearly illegal on the casino's

part,

Gaming will probably rule in your favor and force the casino to pay

in

full. Otherwise Gaming of course sides with the casino. You can
contest the Gaming officer's ruling, and you might get a Gaming

board

···

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Mark" <mark_my_words_again@> wrote:
hearing, otherwise your only recourse is the court system. Read
Nersesian's "Beat the Players", it's got all the details.

#10

What is the EV of 9/5 JOB with a $50K sequential royal? Worth playing at
all??

I, too, am interested to know how you can find out if a descending
sequential royal counts. Some machines will say so on the glass, but others
don't.

Also, is there somewhere that explains basic strategy changes when there is
a sequential royal?

If I ever get a sequential royal, I'm sure that I'll not be playing one of
those machines. Just like I'll be playing some form of Deuces when I get
the 4 Aces plus kicker! :stuck_out_tongue:

···

From: gamblinggrandma <gamblinggrandma@yahoo.com>
Reply-To: <vpFREE@yahoogroups.com>
Date: Sat, 02 Feb 2008 06:03:40 -0000
To: <vpFREE@yahoogroups.com>
Subject: [vpFREE] Re: Either Way (Sequential) Royals

Good Info. I have gotten a sequential royal (only was not playing a
special bonus machine when I did). I often wondered if I would ever
get another one - and maybe I should play those special ones.

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vpFREE%40yahoogroups.com> ,
"nightoftheiguana2000"
<nightoftheiguana2000@...> wrote:

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vpFREE%40yahoogroups.com> , "Mark"

<mark_my_words_again@> wrote:

> So, being that it DOES affect my hold strategies to know which

way or

> ways the SEQ RF pays off, what do YOU recommend I do to get the
answer??
>
> Thanks for your opinion!

#11

What is the EV of 9/5 JOB with a $50K sequential royal? Worth
playing at all??

98.6848% if a sequential in only one direction counts;
98.9198% if a sequential in either direction counts.

Also, is there somewhere that explains basic strategy changes when
there is a sequential royal?

I have strategy guides for Sequential Royal Flush games at
www.vpgenius.com - click on "Jacks or Better (Sequential Royal
Flush)".

For the 9/5 paytable, three cards in position for a sequential beats
a Flush, Three of a Kind, and a Straight. Four cards in position
beats a Straight Flush. One or two cards in position are a little
more involved, but you should still never hold a Ten by itself even
if it's in the proper position and everything else in the hand is
garbage.

If sequentials in both directions count, a Queen in the middle
position by itself is slightly more valuable than if only one
direction counts, because it could fulfill a sequential in either
direction.

···

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Nathan O. Roemer" <public@...> wrote:

#12

What is the EV of 9/5 JOB with a $50K sequential royal? Worth

playing at

all??

I, too, am interested to know how you can find out if a descending
sequential royal counts. Some machines will say so on the glass,

but others

don't.

Also, is there somewhere that explains basic strategy changes when

there is

a sequential royal?

If I ever get a sequential royal, I'm sure that I'll not be playing

one of

those machines. Just like I'll be playing some form of Deuces when

I get

the 4 Aces plus kicker! :stuck_out_tongue:

Wolf Video Poker provides a strategy for sequential RFs. You can
change the paytable as well for progressive RFs and get an updated
strategy at any value.

Dick

···

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Nathan O. Roemer" <public@...> wrote:

#13

>
>
>I doubt that the Strat is contesting that the ticket was a winner.
>They are just saying that, rightfully so, the ticket is no longer

valid

>
I have on occasion waited longer than six months for Terrible's to
deposit my VP markers. Should I stop payment on them on the theory

they

are no longer "valid" and Terribles waited too long to collect

their

"winnings"? Sounds like the same reasoning the Strat is using.

Stratosphere owes the man his money. It would be easy to argue

that 60

days is not a "reasonable time" for a laches limitation on

collection of

debts.

Dave

If it was me, I would have not waited at all. It would have been
nice if the Stratosphere had honored the ticket, but if it has a time
limitation in print, then they are under no obligation to honor it.

Then again, I don't have $1000 handy to place sports bets. I guess I
could also apply that line of reasoning to my Visa bill as well.

GimmeaQuad

···

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, Dave Decot <davedecot@...> wrote: