I noticed a single line pNSU 2's Dream Card machine recently.
According to Wizard of Odds, this would be 99.96%.
However, this machine states in the help screen that the Dream Card appears 58% of the time. The Wiz website states the dream card appears 59% of the time.
1. Can each casino change the % of deals that the Dream Card appears?
2. How much does this 1% lower the pay back of the game?
Thanks, Bill
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Correction,
The Dream Card adds .9996% to bring the pay scale to 99.9127% from the base game at 98.913%
Bill
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Good luck getting an answer. All Deuces Wild games I've checked list 58% as the Dream Card frequency. The 59% might just be a typo in the article but he did the calculation using 58%. Anyone know for sure? I've asked the same question here and on the Wizard's site with no reply. I understand he has sold the site so I guess he is no longer overly concerned with the accuracy of it's content. Perhaps I'm being cynical, but as a businessman I'm assuming he hopes the site dies so he can recreate it under another name with accurate up to date information when the non-compete period has expired. Bob still occasionally has him on his internet show, maybe he can ask him this Deuces Wild Dream Card question next appearance.
Sent from my iPhone
On Jun 7, 2015, at 2:24 PM, billchute2@yahoo.com [vpFREE] <vpFREE@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
I noticed a single line pNSU 2's Dream Card machine recently.
According to Wizard of Odds, this would be 99.96%.However, this machine states in the help screen that the Dream Card appears 58% of the time. The Wiz website states the dream card appears 59% of the time.
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The WOO Dream Card webpage states that the presented figures are within .01% of those published separately in a Bob Dancer article on the game (Dancer's numbers sourced from the manufacturer).
I wouldn't be concerned over the DC frequency discrepancy.
- H.
---In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, <vegasvpplayer@...> wrote :
Good luck getting an answer. All Deuces Wild games I've checked list 58% as the Dream Card frequency. The 59% might just be a typo in the article but he did the calculation using 58%. Anyone know for sure? I've asked the same question here and on the Wizard's site with no reply. I understand he has sold the site so I guess he is no longer overly concerned with the accuracy of it's content. Perhaps I'm being cynical, but as a businessman I'm assuming he hopes the site dies so he can recreate it under another name with accurate up to date information when the non-compete period has expired. Bob still occasionally has him on his internet show, maybe he can ask him this Deuces Wild Dream Card question next appearance.
Sent from my iPhone
> On Jun 7, 2015, at 2:24 PM, billchute2@… mailto:billchute2@… [vpFREE] <vpFREE@yahoogroups.com mailto:vpF…@…com> wrote:
>
> I noticed a single line pNSU 2's Dream Card machine recently.
> According to Wizard of Odds, this would be 99.96%.
>
> However, this machine states in the help screen that the Dream Card appears 58% of the time. The Wiz website states the dream card appears 59% of the time.
>
>
>
>
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Do you know if Bob used the 58% or 59% Dream Card frequency? I don't think this article is any longer available for viewing by the public. Action Gaming may have decreased the frequency because casinos felt it was too generous. Hard to believe WOO would have used the wrong figure on every deuces wild game unless his web person was really incompetent.
Sent from my iPhone
On Jun 9, 2015, at 5:41 AM, harry.porter@verizon.net [vpFREE] <vpFREE@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
The WOO Dream Card webpage states that the presented figures are within .01% of those published separately in a Bob Dancer article on the game (Dancer's numbers sourced from the manufacturer).
I wouldn't be concerned over the DC frequency discrepancy.
- H.
---In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, <vegasvpplayer@...> wrote :
Good luck getting an answer. All Deuces Wild games I've checked list 58% as the Dream Card frequency. The 59% might just be a typo in the article but he did the calculation using 58%. Anyone know for sure? I've asked the same question here and on the Wizard's site with no reply. I understand he has sold the site so I guess he is no longer overly concerned with the accuracy of it's content. Perhaps I'm being cynical, but as a businessman I'm assuming he hopes the site dies so he can recreate it under another name with accurate up to date information when the non-compete period has expired. Bob still occasionally has him on his internet show, maybe he can ask him this Deuces Wild Dream Card question next appearance.
Sent from my iPhone
> On Jun 7, 2015, at 2:24 PM, billchute2@… mailto:billchute2@… [vpFREE] <vpFREE@yahoogroups.com mailto:vpF…@…com> wrote:
>
> I noticed a single line pNSU 2's Dream Card machine recently.
> According to Wizard of Odds, this would be 99.96%.
>
> However, this machine states in the help screen that the Dream Card appears 58% of the time. The Wiz website states the dream card appears 59% of the time.
>
>
>
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I thought I had replied to this earlier, but don't see the post. Maybe I self-edited. In any case, I've rethought the reply.
Bob reported the numbers provided by the manufacturer.
If the original 99.91% published ER for 9/15 DW was based upon a 59% Dreamcard frequency, but the actual installed frequency was 58%, I guesstimate (with likely accuracy) that this would reduce the ER by 0.85% to 99.05%.
That's a sufficient return depression that I'd be inclined to want to get this sorted before venturing with play.
That will only happen with someone running the numbers/probabilities in the manner that produced the game stat's in WOO's webpage, or perhaps contacting the manufacturer themselves.
The calculation is extensive, but by no means onerous (more likely just tedious). Perhaps you can get noti to dedicate the time.
- H.
---In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, <vegasvpplayer@...> wrote :
Do you know if Bob used the 58% or 59% Dream Card frequency? I don't think this article is any longer available for viewing by the public. Action Gaming may have decreased the frequency because casinos felt it was too generous. Hard to believe WOO would have used the wrong figure on every deuces wild game unless his web person was really incompetent\
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Are you sure you’re not missing a zero on that devaluation. One percent reduction in dreamcard frequency doesn’t seem at first glance to be as significant as you say. Another thing couldn’t the difference in the %58 and %59 numbers just be a rounding difference and the actual difference could actually be less than %1. Just asking questions I’m no math whiz.
Regards
A.P.
From: mailto:vpF…@…com
Sent: Tuesday, June 09, 2015 7:02 PM
To: vpFREE@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [vpFREE] Dream Card
I thought I had replied to this earlier, but don't see the post. Maybe I self-edited. In any case, I've rethought the reply.
Bob reported the numbers provided by the manufacturer.
If the original 99.91% published ER for 9/15 DW was based upon a 59% Dreamcard frequency, but the actual installed frequency was 58%, I guesstimate (with likely accuracy) that this would reduce the ER by 0.85% to 99.05%.
That's a sufficient return depression that I'd be inclined to want to get this sorted before venturing with play.
That will only happen with someone running the numbers/probabilities in the manner that produced the game stat's in WOO's webpage, or perhaps contacting the manufacturer themselves.
The calculation is extensive, but by no means onerous (more likely just tedious). Perhaps you can get noti to dedicate the time.
- H.
---In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, <vegasvpplayer@...> wrote :
Do you know if Bob used the 58% or 59% Dream Card frequency? I don't think this article is any longer available for viewing by the public. Action Gaming may have decreased the frequency because casinos felt it was too generous. Hard to believe WOO would have used the wrong figure on every deuces wild game unless his web person was really incompetent\
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I don't mind the question, because I originally pretty much dismissed the impact at first glance.
However, factor in that most Dreamcard hands with the feature active have an ER approaching 300%. (See WOO's website for confirmation. For 9/15 DW, I back into a "Dreamcard active" ER of 270%) It's now not difficult to imagine that a mere 1% shift in the Dreamcard frequency will have a significant impact on ER.
Weighting the reduced ER associated with Dreamcard hands and the increased ER associated with standard hands, under an assumption of a 1% reduction in Dreamcard frequency, vs the original stated game ER, I arrive at a 0.85 ER reduction.
- H.
---In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, <ehpee@...> wrote :
Are you sure you’re not missing a zero on that devaluation. One percent reduction in dreamcard frequency doesn’t seem at first glance to be as significant as you say. Another thing couldn’t the difference in the %58 and %59 numbers just be a rounding difference and the actual difference could actually be less than %1. Just asking questions I’m no math whiz.
Regards
A.P.
From: mailto:vpF…@…com
Sent: Tuesday, June 09, 2015 7:02 PM
To: vpFREE@yahoogroups.com mailto:vpF…@…com
Subject: Re: [vpFREE] Dream Card
I thought I had replied to this earlier, but don't see the post. Maybe I self-edited. In any case, I've rethought the reply.
Bob reported the numbers provided by the manufacturer.
If the original 99.91% published ER for 9/15 DW was based upon a 59% Dreamcard frequency, but the actual installed frequency was 58%, I guesstimate (with likely accuracy) that this would reduce the ER by 0.85% to 99.05%.
That's a sufficient return depression that I'd be inclined to want to get this sorted before venturing with play.
That will only happen with someone running the numbers/probabilities in the manner that produced the game stat's in WOO's webpage, or perhaps contacting the manufacturer themselves.
The calculation is extensive, but by no means onerous (more likely just tedious). Perhaps you can get noti to dedicate the time.
- H.
—In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com mailto:vpF…@…com, <vegasvpplayer@…> wrote :
Do you know if Bob used the 58% or 59% Dream Card frequency? I don't think this article is any longer available for viewing by the public. Action Gaming may have decreased the frequency because casinos felt it was too generous. Hard to believe WOO would have used the wrong figure on every deuces wild game unless his web person was really incompetent\
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Thanks for the analysis Harry! I was wondering if the 1% drop in Dream Card frequency would equate with an approximately equal drop in EV. That was my gut feeling.
I still hope the error is just in sloppy typing on the part of WOO's underlings and can be verified by he or Bob. It seems odd Action Gaming would only change the Dream Card frequency on the deuces wild options of this game platform.
Sent from my iPhone
On Jun 9, 2015, at 4:02 PM, harry.porter@verizon.net [vpFREE] <vpFREE@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
If the original 99.91% published ER for 9/15 DW was based upon a 59% Dreamcard frequency, but the actual installed frequency was 58%, I guesstimate (with likely accuracy) that this would reduce the ER by 0.85% to 99.05%.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]