I am still wondering if the "Double Down" feature on winning hands
should be used other than just for "gambling excitement".
If two 9/6 $1 JoB machines are available, and one machine has this
feature, should you pick the double down machine? If so, how would
you use this feature. Does it add to the EV of the game if you use it?
Thanks
Bob
Bob,
For 9/6 JoB, the double-down feature is a better bet (100%) than the
base game (99.54%). However, it is typically not considered a wager
for comps purposes. So you are not earning points, working towards a
higher tier, etc.
Everyone will have their own answer on how double-down should be used.
Personally, I would not use it on a game where I have a net positive
expectation when all factors are considered.
Ken
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "futrend" <futrend@...> wrote:
I am still wondering if the "Double Down" feature on winning hands
should be used other than just for "gambling excitement".
If two 9/6 $1 JoB machines are available, and one machine has this
feature, should you pick the double down machine? If so, how would
you use this feature. Does it add to the EV of the game if you use it?Thanks
Bob
If designed the way I understand, this is a fair side bet...EV of
100%. I am not sure if the doubling feature affects points or not.
If it does, then it is probably not a bad bet, but you will need to
take this into account when you figure your bankroll, since this will
add a substantial amount of volatility, especially if you try to
double big wins.
- John
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "futrend" <futrend@...> wrote:
I am still wondering if the "Double Down" feature on winning hands
should be used other than just for "gambling excitement".
If two 9/6 $1 JoB machines are available, and one machine has this
feature, should you pick the double down machine? If so, how would
you use this feature. Does it add to the EV of the game if you use it?Thanks
Bob
I really like the double down feature. I gamble to make money without concern for points. A number of times I have doubled down on a 40 win to 80 to 160 to 320 to 640 units. I have always run out of hutzpa at that point.
philipj
<html><div>philip j.</div></html>
From: "futrend" <futrend@yahoo.com>
Reply-To: vpFREE@yahoogroups.com
To: vpFREE@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [vpFREE] Double Down Feature
Date: Fri, 03 Nov 2006 15:26:07 -0000I am still wondering if the "Double Down" feature on winning hands
should be used other than just for "gambling excitement".
If two 9/6 $1 JoB machines are available, and one machine has this
feature, should you pick the double down machine? If so, how would
you use this feature. Does it add to the EV of the game if you use it?Thanks
Bob
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If you truly gamble to make money, then there is absolutely no reason
to use the double-down feature. It is an even-money bet -- it
provides no long-term benefit. Someone that gambles to make money
will always be playing with a greater than 100% expected return, so
taking time out to play an even money game would cost them money.
And if you truly gamble to make money, it would be foolish to ignore
points. They are typically a dramatic part of the overall return.
Ignoring them -- and therefore not working to maximize this part of
your return -- is a big drain on your bankroll.
Basically, I find it difficult to believe that any knowledgeable
advantage player would use the double-down feature for anything other
than entertainment...they certainly cannot be using it to make money.
Ken
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Philip Dembinski"
<philipdembinski@...> wrote:
I really like the double down feature. I gamble to make money without
concern for points. A number of times I have doubled down on a 40
win to 80
to 160 to 320 to 640 units. I have always run out of hutzpa at that
point.
philipj
<html><div>philip j.</div></html>
If you're a fast player, the double down feature will slow down your
game if you don't plan to use it often. I find it annoying having to
press the "Take Win" button every time you have a paying hand.
There's a game I like to play at my fave casino but it's only
available on a single bank of machines and they all have this feature
installed. Off the top off my head, it slows down my play by about
10%. I wish there was a switch to toggle it on or off.
With no intent whatever, to rain on your parade, I wonder how many
times you have also whiffed away your 40 coin win?
I truly believe that every player should play however and whatever
gives them the most enjoyment, and the biggest bang for their buck.
However, as one who dislikes the double-down feature, because I NEVER
use it, and it slows me way down, I'm curious if you've kept your
losing records as well.
Regards,
~Babe~
============================================
In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Philip Dembinski" <philipdembinski@...>
wrote:
I really like the double down feature. I gamble to make money
without concern for points. A number of times I have doubled down on
a 40 win to 80 to 160 to 320 to 640 units. I have always run out of
hutzpa at that point.
At some casinos the technicians will turn off the double up feature (or
vice versa) if requested.
EE
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "MJT" <boo11204@...> wrote:
There's a game I like to play at my fave casino but it's only
available on a single bank of machines and they all have this feature
installed. Off the top off my head, it slows down my play by about
10%. I wish there was a switch to toggle it on or off.
Yes Babe( I hope you are female) I have kept records, to a fault. I start with $2000.00 upon entering the war zone(casino). When I am up anything over $275.00 I cash in and leave the building. I have gotten my car back from Valet and driven away with the first cup of coffee still in my hand.
<html><div>philip j.</div></html>
From: "jackessiebabe" <jackessiebabe@yahoo.com>
Reply-To: vpFREE@yahoogroups.com
To: vpFREE@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [vpFREE] Re: Double Down Feature
Date: Fri, 03 Nov 2006 17:44:52 -0000With no intent whatever, to rain on your parade, I wonder how many
times you have also whiffed away your 40 coin win?I truly believe that every player should play however and whatever
gives them the most enjoyment, and the biggest bang for their buck.
However, as one who dislikes the double-down feature, because I NEVER
use it, and it slows me way down, I'm curious if you've kept your
losing records as well.Regards,
~Babe~In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Philip Dembinski" <philipdembinski@...>
wrote:I really like the double down feature. I gamble to make money
without concern for points. A number of times I have doubled down on
a 40 win to 80 to 160 to 320 to 640 units. I have always run out of
hutzpa at that point.
_________________________________________________________________
Get FREE company branded e-mail accounts and business Web site from Microsoft Office Live http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/mcrssaub0050001411mrt/direct/01/
-vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Philip Dembinski"philipdembinski@...>
wrote:
Yes Babe( I hope you are female)..........
I have kept records, to a fault. I start with $2000.00
I'm sure that as prudent player you would keep assiduously detailed
records of session wins and losses. What I was attempting to ask
was, if you knew whether doubling up repeatedly, had been profitable
to you in the "long run". In other words, did you receive a greater
profit from your successful double-ups, than you lost when you
unfortunately drew a lower card then the machine's card, and lost
your bet and your profit.
Again, I am NOT preaching or criticizing your method of play or
trying to suggest what you should do in the future. It's merely a
matter of curiosity to me, since I never avail myself of this option.
Regards,
~Babe~
I can think of a reason. Say you are playing $1 JoB in a promotion
where it takes a $250 win to get a drawing ticket. You can get a lot
more entries by playing the DD on all quads. Years ago Golden Nugget
LV used to have an annual event where you got drawing tickets for wins
over a certain threshold. Just before the promotion, they would
actually go around the casino and turn off the DD on all machines in
the casino.
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "kkirschner" <ken.kirschner@...> wrote:
If you truly gamble to make money, then there is absolutely no reason
to use the double-down feature. It is an even-money bet -- it
provides no long-term benefit. >>>
Good call -- an odd promotion could give a reason to use the double-up
feature. But it is pretty obvious this is not what he is doing...
Ken
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "vegasvpplayer" <vegasvpplayer@...> wrote:
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "kkirschner" <ken.kirschner@> wrote:
>
> If you truly gamble to make money, then there is absolutely no reason
> to use the double-down feature. It is an even-money bet -- it
> provides no long-term benefit. >>>I can think of a reason. Say you are playing $1 JoB in a promotion
where it takes a $250 win to get a drawing ticket. You can get a lot
more entries by playing the DD on all quads. Years ago Golden Nugget
LV used to have an annual event where you got drawing tickets for wins
over a certain threshold. Just before the promotion, they would
actually go around the casino and turn off the DD on all machines in
the casino.
You are right, that was not my situation, but such information was
part of what I wanted understand about when to use or not use the
double down option. I simply want to come to some conclusions. I
appreciate everyone's opinion and from those ideas I will better
understand the feature and maybe help others in the future if the
double down question comes up.
Thanks to all
Bob
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "kkirschner" <ken.kirschner@...> wrote:
Good call -- an odd promotion could give a reason to use the double-
up feature. But it is pretty obvious this is not what he is doing...
Ken
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "vegasvpplayer" <vegasvpplayer@>
wrote:
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "kkirschner" <ken.kirschner@> wrote:
If you truly gamble to make money, then there is absolutely no
reason to use the double-down feature. It is an even-money bet -- it
provides no long-term benefit. >>>
I can think of a reason. Say you are playing $1 JoB in a promotion
where it takes a $250 win to get a drawing ticket. You can get a
lot more entries by playing the DD on all quads. Years ago Golden
Nugget LV used to have an annual event where you got drawing tickets
for wins over a certain threshold. Just before the promotion, they
would actually go around the casino and turn off the DD on all
machines in
the casino.
Bob,
While you are right that my comment works in your situation, you are
not the "he" I was referring to in this post. Rather, I was referring
to the poster that said he plays to win money and also said he uses
the double down feature.
If you are playing in a -EV situation, the double-down is not a bad
thing. If you are doing the double-down for fun, this is not a bad
thing. But if you are playing to win -- which would indicate a +EV
situation -- then using the double-down is counter-productive.
In your case, I would say double-down whenever you think the thrill of
the double-down is worthwhile...
Hope that clears things up.
Ken
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "futrend" <futrend@...> wrote:
You are right, that was not my situation, but such information was
part of what I wanted understand about when to use or not use the
double down option. I simply want to come to some conclusions. I
appreciate everyone's opinion and from those ideas I will better
understand the feature and maybe help others in the future if the
double down question comes up.Thanks to all
Bob--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "kkirschner" <ken.kirschner@> wrote:
Good call -- an odd promotion could give a reason to use the double-
up feature. But it is pretty obvious this is not what he is doing...Ken
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Philip Dembinski"
<philipdembinski@...> wrote:
Yes Babe( I hope you are female) I have kept records, to a fault.
I start
with $2000.00 upon entering the war zone(casino). When I am up
anything
over $275.00 I cash in and leave the building. I have gotten my
car back
from Valet and driven away with the first cup of coffee still in my
hand.
Phillip,
How much so you have to lose before you quit?
I sometimes take a specific amount and play the double down machines, I feel realy good when I win and hate it when I lose but it's fun so that's why I do it.
kkirschner <ken.kirschner@gmail.com> wrote: Bob,
While you are right that my comment works in your situation, you are
not the "he" I was referring to in this post. Rather, I was referring
to the poster that said he plays to win money and also said he uses
the double down feature.
If you are playing in a -EV situation, the double-down is not a bad
thing. If you are doing the double-down for fun, this is not a bad
thing. But if you are playing to win -- which would indicate a +EV
situation -- then using the double-down is counter-productive.
In your case, I would say double-down whenever you think the thrill of
the double-down is worthwhile...
Hope that clears things up.
Ken
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "futrend" <futrend@...> wrote:
>
> You are right, that was not my situation, but such information was
> part of what I wanted understand about when to use or not use the
> double down option. I simply want to come to some conclusions. I
> appreciate everyone's opinion and from those ideas I will better
> understand the feature and maybe help others in the future if the
> double down question comes up.
>
> Thanks to all
> Bob
>
> --- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "kkirschner" <ken.kirschner@> wrote:
>
> Good call -- an odd promotion could give a reason to use the double-
> up feature. But it is pretty obvious this is not what he is doing...
>
> Ken
>
---------------------------------
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
That plays exactly to what I am saying -- it is fine to use the
double-down feature for entertainment. But in the absence of an odd
promotion, the double-down feature cannot be used for long-term gain.
Ken
I sometimes take a specific amount and play the double down
machines, I feel realy good when I win and hate it when I lose but
it's fun so that's why I do it.
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, Paly <pal409@...> wrote: