If I discard say the 9d and when I draw I receive the 9d again, is that standard on a video poker machine? Or should that card not be in the deck during the draw?
I noticed this at Showboat AC.
Discarding and getting same card
If you think there is a malfunction, ask a slot attendant to review the play.
My husband was dealt a hand with 3 red sevens after the draw on a $1 pick-em. Not only that, but he had a black seven as well, for a 4-of-a-kind. But, no pay out. Upon closer inspection, we noticed two of the cards were the 7 of diamonds. This happened on a pick-em machine at Windsor. We called a host, who called a techie, and he checked the machine out. Apparently, the display was incorrect, and they showed us what the actual card was, on the screen they looked at inside the machine. They didn't pay out the 4-of-a-kind, as it was a machine malfunction. I think they did give us something - maybe $25 and a couple of meal comps - I don't really remember. This happened about 2 years ago.
T&J
···
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "JackC" <jackal228@...> wrote:
If I discard say the 9d and when I draw I receive the 9d again, is that standard on a video poker machine? Or should that card not be in the deck during the draw?
I noticed this at Showboat AC.
We actually discussed this a couple of months ago. Assuming you did not
accidently hold the card, you should never get the same card back on the
draw playing a normal VP machine. The laws in Nevada, AC, Illinois, Indiana,
Colorado, etc. indicate that a game that simulates the dealing of a deck of
cards must be as random as possible to simulating that deal and the draw
(For games that require a draw.). There is at least one internet gambling
site that has this possibility normally and it costs the players between 4
and 5 percent.
···
From: vpFREE@yahoogroups.com [mailto:vpF…@…com] On Behalf Of
tee_and_j
Sent: Friday, September 17, 2010 2:58 PM
To: vpFREE@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [vpFREE] Re: Discarding and getting same card
If you think there is a malfunction, ask a slot attendant to review the
play.
My husband was dealt a hand with 3 red sevens after the draw on a $1
pick-em. Not only that, but he had a black seven as well, for a 4-of-a-kind.
But, no pay out. Upon closer inspection, we noticed two of the cards were
the 7 of diamonds. This happened on a pick-em machine at Windsor. We called
a host, who called a techie, and he checked the machine out. Apparently, the
display was incorrect, and they showed us what the actual card was, on the
screen they looked at inside the machine. They didn't pay out the
4-of-a-kind, as it was a machine malfunction. I think they did give us
something - maybe $25 and a couple of meal comps - I don't really remember.
This happened about 2 years ago.
T&J
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vpFREE%40yahoogroups.com> , "JackC"
<jackal228@...> wrote:
If I discard say the 9d and when I draw I receive the 9d again, is that
standard on a video poker machine? Or should that card not be in the deck
during the draw?
I noticed this at Showboat AC.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
I've been hearing about this phenomenon from other players since the early nineties. There have been times where I thought "Didn't I just throw that card away?" I eventually chalked it all up to my mind playing tricks on me. I didn't just throw away the 7 of diamonds, I threw away the 7 of hearts mistaking it for the 7 of diamonds.
JackC wrote:
If I discard say the 9d and when I draw I receive the 9d again, is that standard on a video poker machine? Or should that card not be in the deck during the draw?
I noticed this at Showboat AC.
As discussed, this shouldn't ever happen. And it's been my steadfast contention that when such a thing is noticed, it's almost certainly a case where a discard was replaced with another card of the same rank and same color, but definitely different suit (for example, 7d discard, 7h draw).
With reasonably fast play, the overlap of the two cards (with pip shapes that trace over each other with something like 80% similarity) is so very close that to the eye that is only indirectly watching a given card it appears almost certainly that there was no card change at all.
That said, I'm going to kindle a fire that in my gut I'd much rather not ...
Last weekend (also in AC) an adjacent player called my attention to their 4 card royal hold and, after wishing them luck, my focus was riveted to the discard -- my eyes fixed on the smaller pip, with lesser focus on the rank (I recall they were discarding a 4s).
After a few seconds, the womand said, "drat". I was puzzled ... I hadn't seen a card change and was still waiting for the draw. I looked, and indeed the draw was over, and she said that from what she saw she was dealt the discard again.
Had this been my play, I would have called an attendent over to bring up the play history. But, decided against urging her do to so. ("beware unintended consequences", etc.)
The bottom line is that I now am willing give far more credance to tales of redealt cards on the draw and am more vigilent in my own play. There's a chance my eyes played tricks, but I put it at less than 5% likelihood in this instance.
At any rate, if this is something that does occur on IGT machines, I put the incidence at something less than 1 in 100,000 hands ... likely much, much rarer.
<Harry & Bev are having a kick-ass weekend in NOLA! No big wins, but running a 1% loss 
Lets turn that into at least a nice 5% win, good luck Harry!
···
----- Original Message -----
From: "vp_wiz" <harry.porter@verizon.net>
To: vpFREE@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, September 18, 2010 11:49:13 AM
Subject: [vpFREE] Re: Discarding and getting same card
JackC wrote:
If I discard say the 9d and when I draw I receive the 9d again, is that standard on a video poker machine? Or should that card not be in the deck during the draw?
I noticed this at Showboat AC.
As discussed, this shouldn't ever happen. And it's been my steadfast contention that when such a thing is noticed, it's almost certainly a case where a discard was replaced with another card of the same rank and same color, but definitely different suit (for example, 7d discard, 7h draw).
With reasonably fast play, the overlap of the two cards (with pip shapes that trace over each other with something like 80% similarity) is so very close that to the eye that is only indirectly watching a given card it appears almost certainly that there was no card change at all.
That said, I'm going to kindle a fire that in my gut I'd much rather not ...
Last weekend (also in AC) an adjacent player called my attention to their 4 card royal hold and, after wishing them luck, my focus was riveted to the discard -- my eyes fixed on the smaller pip, with lesser focus on the rank (I recall they were discarding a 4s).
After a few seconds, the womand said, "drat". I was puzzled ... I hadn't seen a card change and was still waiting for the draw. I looked, and indeed the draw was over, and she said that from what she saw she was dealt the discard again.
Had this been my play, I would have called an attendent over to bring up the play history. But, decided against urging her do to so. ("beware unintended consequences", etc.)
The bottom line is that I now am willing give far more credance to tales of redealt cards on the draw and am more vigilent in my own play. There's a chance my eyes played tricks, but I put it at less than 5% likelihood in this instance.
At any rate, if this is something that does occur on IGT machines, I put the incidence at something less than 1 in 100,000 hands ... likely much, much rarer.
<Harry & Bev are having a kick-ass weekend in NOLA! No big wins, but running a 1% loss
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
I've always believed this, as it's completely logical, but am unable to find specific wording in the Nevada regs on handling of discards and the subsequent draw. This is likely due to my brain vs the density of the regs - but each jurisdiction should specify the disposition of discards - if not, then the manufacturer can? This is independent of a random deal - can discards be folded back into the deck, then the draw be dealt randomly?
···
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Howard W. Stern" <howard.w.stern@...> wrote:
We actually discussed this a couple of months ago. Assuming you did not
accidently hold the card, you should never get the same card back on the
draw playing a normal VP machine. The laws in Nevada, AC, Illinois, Indiana,
Colorado, etc. indicate that a game that simulates the dealing of a deck of
cards must be as random as possible to simulating that deal and the draw
(For games that require a draw.). There is at least one internet gambling
site that has this possibility normally and it costs the players between 4
and 5 percent.
Regulation 14.040 2(b):
(b) For gaming devices that are representative of live gambling
games, the mathematical
probability of a symbol or other element appearing in a game outcome
must be equal to the
mathematical probability of that symbol or element occurring in the
live gambling game. For other
gaming devices, the mathematical probability of a symbol appearing in
a position in any game
outcome must be constant.
···
----------------------------------------
To: vpFREE@yahoogroups.com
From: allen-walker@sbcglobal.net
Date: Sat, 18 Sep 2010 23:04:40 +0000
Subject: [vpFREE] Re: Discarding and getting same cardI've always believed this, as it's completely logical, but am unable to find specific wording in the Nevada regs on handling of discards and the subsequent draw. This is likely due to my brain vs the density of the regs - but each jurisdiction should specify the disposition of discards - if not, then the manufacturer can? This is independent of a random deal - can discards be folded back into the deck, then the draw be dealt randomly?
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Howard W. Stern" wrote:
>
> We actually discussed this a couple of months ago. Assuming you did not
> accidently hold the card, you should never get the same card back on the
> draw playing a normal VP machine. The laws in Nevada, AC, Illinois, Indiana,
> Colorado, etc. indicate that a game that simulates the dealing of a deck of
> cards must be as random as possible to simulating that deal and the draw
> (For games that require a draw.). There is at least one internet gambling
> site that has this possibility normally and it costs the players between 4
> and 5 percent.------------------------------------
vpFREE Links: http://members.cox.net/vpfree/Links.htm
Yahoo! Groups Links
<Harry & Bev are having a kick-ass weekend in NOLA! No big wins, but running a 1% loss
sewellnj replied:
Lets turn that into at least a nice 5% win, good luck Harry!
Lovely sentiment, John ... not in the cards though 
We played Bev's card on Saturday, finding our luck returned to the 4% loss rate that has been the mainstay of past NOLA visits.
Still, given lesser play, the aggregate loss came in at just 1.4% ... a real breath of fresh air!
Took in a couple of real knock out meals this trip:
- to "die-for" lunch at Muriel's (on Jackson Sqaure)
- and a dinner that left me scrambling for my socks at Nola where Bev's fried chicken was done to perfection and my bread-crumb crusted drum (a first taste of the fish for me) was bite after bite of sheer ecstasy.
Dinner at Besh was reliably satisfactory ... a prime asset at Harrah's.
Let the fasting commence ...
- H.
Uh..Harry..that was Fri. sundown till Sat.sundown
Larry F.
···
--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "vp_wiz" <harry.porter@...> wrote:
Let the fasting commence ...
- H.