vpFREE2 Forums

Comp calculations

#1

Maybe this is a conspiracy theory thing, but are the new machines
smart enough to be tracking optimal play when it comes to
calculating comps?

It is easy for a pit boss to scale down the bet size when tracking
someone is playing blackjack with a basic strategy card versus
someone who has it all in their head. If they see the strategy
card, the boss knows what the EV of the player is going to be. This
is why some players make small bets and dumb mistakes in the
beginning to throw off the play.

But for VP machines, can the machine track your plays and realize
you are playing 9/6 JOB at 99.5% versus someone who is just doing it
for fun? I know AC and LV machines have strict RNG rules for the
cards being dealt, but could the casinos be catching on with their
comp systems? I have noticed as my play gets better based on
practicing, my comps are getting lower.

Just because you are paranoid doesn't mean there is not someone
out to get you.

#2

No, absolutely. No such software has been approved by gaming in New Jersey
or Nevada. It is possible, and may be the future but it is not so today.

Your reductions are not due to your skill level, but the coincidence that
more casinos are basing mailers and comps on theoretical win which is lower

···

on full-pay VP. Bill At 10:57 AM 06/04/2005, you wrote:

Maybe this is a conspiracy theory thing, but are the new machines
smart enough to be tracking optimal play when it comes to
calculating comps?

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

#3

Reno Eldorado uses the Mindplay Blackjack system which records each
card and rates players for play and dealers for mistakes. Was this
system approved by gaming.nv.gov?

No, absolutely. No such software has been approved by gaming in New

Jersey

or Nevada. It is possible, and may be the future but it is not so

today.

Your reductions are not due to your skill level, but the coincidence

that

more casinos are basing mailers and comps on theoretical win which

is lower

···

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, Bill Coleman <vphobby2@c...> wrote:

on full-pay VP. > > Bill > > At 10:57 AM 06/04/2005, you wrote:
>Maybe this is a conspiracy theory thing, but are the new machines
>smart enough to be tracking optimal play when it comes to
>calculating comps?

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

#4

http://www.google.com/search?q=mindplay+blackjack

#5

Very interesting. I can't wait until they build this automatically
into the shuffle machine or the shoe. :frowning:

I haven't seen any of these in AC yet.

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "nightoftheiguana2000"
<nightoftheiguana2000@y...> wrote:

Reno Eldorado uses the Mindplay Blackjack system which records each
card and rates players for play and dealers for mistakes. Was this
system approved by gaming.nv.gov?

> No, absolutely. No such software has been approved by gaming in

New

Jersey
> or Nevada. It is possible, and may be the future but it is not so
today.
>
> Your reductions are not due to your skill level, but the

coincidence

that
> more casinos are basing mailers and comps on theoretical win

which

is lower
> >Maybe this is a conspiracy theory thing, but are the new

machines

···

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, Bill Coleman <vphobby2@c...> wrote:
> on full-pay VP. > > > > Bill > > > > At 10:57 AM 06/04/2005, you wrote:
> >smart enough to be tracking optimal play when it comes to
> >calculating comps?
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

#6

I'm speaking of Video Poker skill tracking software. Mind Play is the first
of many pit tracking software systems.

Bill

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "nightoftheiguana2000"

<nightoftheiguana2000@y...> wrote:
> Reno Eldorado uses the Mindplay Blackjack system which records each
> card and rates players for play and dealers for mistakes. Was this
> system approved by gaming.nv.gov?
>
> > No, absolutely. No such software has been approved by gaming in
New
> Jersey
> > or Nevada. It is possible, and may be the future but it is not so
> today.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

···

> --- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, Bill Coleman <vphobby2@c...> wrote:

#7

..... It is easy for a pit boss to scale down the bet size when

tracking someone who is playing blackjack with a basic strategy card
versus someone who has it all in their head. If they see the
strategy

card, the boss knows what the EV of the player is going to

be......>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

In my experience, anyone using a BS card at the blackjack table is
going to have nowhere near the basic strategy EV, because they refuse
to follow the advice on the card! Sometimes they simply can't read
the card, and sometimes they just refuse to go along with the non-
intuitive advice on hands like 9,9 vs. 9 (split). Most often they
abandon the advice on the card the first time the strategy
goes "wrong", such as when they bust a 12 vs. 2 when they would have
won by standing. This is about the time the dealer says "you know
the casinos wrote that card", and after that the player with the card
starts to play either by the seat of their pants, or according to the
collective wisdom of the table - which will often be incorrect. I
have never, and I do mean NEVER, seen anyone with one of those basic
strategy cards who actually plays 100% according to the advice on the
card.

Curiously, the same can NOT be said for VP players using strategy
cards. Practically everyone I have seen consulting a VP strategy
card is a good player who is looking up a tricky hand in order to
make the correct play. I don't ever recall watching a video poker
player who took the time to look up a hand on a strategy chart, and
then played the hand another way because he didn't like what the
chart said (you see this all the time at the blackjack table).

This is an interesting difference between blackjack and VP. In
blackjack - only novices use a strategy card, and they still don't
follow the advice on the card. In VP, it's almost always experienced
players who use a strategy chart (novices don't know what a strategy
chart is) and they follow the chart's advice every time.

EE

···

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "artinnj" <artinnj@y...> wrote:

#8

This is an interesting difference between blackjack and >VP. In

blackjack - only novices use a strategy

card, and they still don't follow the advice on the card.

This may be true in most cases, but for me personally, this little card was
a great piece of cover. Years and years ago I bought 25 of them from GBC
over on 11th and Charleston. The wife and I would have one out on the table
that we "shared" almost every time that we played. It was especially handy
when the deck went negative and you had to hit a stiff. As an example, in
the system that I use I have to stand on 12 vs a 4 at 0 or higher TC. So,
on any negative true, I would pick up my ten and two in the ready to scratch
position, and right on cue the wife would say something like " you're not
gonna hit that, are you? The card says to stand." Now, as you mentioned
earlier in your post, it is now my turn to say to the wife, "Honey, didn't
you hear the dealer a few minutes ago when he asked who do you think printed
this card, and he said the casino? Besides, even if he has the ten under
his four like we think, he can still draw a 3,4,5,6 or 7 to make his hand.
That's five cards. I have a 12 so I can draw a 5,6,7,8, or 9 to make my
hand, also 5 cards. Sounds like an even bet to me so I'm hittin the damn
thing. I don't care what the card says." We could usually get a few of
these type of incidences at every session, sometimes even asking the dealer
or the pit boss if he would sling this damn worthless card in his little
garbage can for us. With the right little skit, you would be surprised how
some of these tactics can aid in removing heat.
                                                             Nudge