vpFREE2 Forums

Can't technology limit the damage?

#1

Concerning the loss of good games due to excessive play...

It would seem to me that in this day & age of the computer-controlled
comp system and networked machines on the floor the casino could easily
limit the damage a deranged pro or comp abuser is doing by simply
setting a software flag in the undesirable player's account that limits
the play or comps he gets on the machine. When the undesirable player
inserts his player's card the machine could either allow him to play but
not add any comp points, or not allow any play at all and spit out a
cashout ticket for any money he's inserted. Couldn't that be easily done
in software and wouldn't it be much simpler than human intervention
after the fact?

The computer could even monitor your play for a given period of time,
like your amount of play in 24 hours, and have it cutoff comp points
after a preset level that is deemed excessive. Why do they wait until
after someone greedily plays 14 hours a day for 2 weeks before taking
the game away from everyone? Just blacklist the offender in their comp
system, give him minimum or no comps and let everyone else keep playing.
They could even have the machine drop back to single coin play instead
of max coins. And pass the player's name & bio around so all casinos
could know this guy. There's all kind of limits that could be done to
the individual that is abusing the comp system. Granted, this wouldn't
help with players that don't use a card that are just playing for the
cash, but that's a much smaller group of abusers isn't it?

I think Nevada courts have consistently ruled that the casino has the
right to refuse/limit service to anyone.

Isn't this idea possible and more fair, allowing the good machines to be
available to the pro players that use moderation. And cheaper for the
casino, since they'd not have to take action after the fact. I'm not
against players making money off the casinos, but seems like more & more
we are all losing due to the actions of a few.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

#2

First, the software available does not have this capability. It is also difficult to impute from play who does or does not fit this category.

Also, this would be a grey area and Gaming Control could rule either way.

There are other ways, first and foremost analyzing and limiting risks, not by removing all good games, just the ones that would attract the kind of player described. After all, you can easily absorb the small losses generated at 5c, 10c, and 25c positives if enough people play badly to make the games at least break even. $1 and $2 plays are often good risks. $5 and up plays often are not good risks, but there have been cases of machines that made a lot of money when they attracted the pros and make much less money after they were downgraded. (I am not at liberty to give more information so please don't ask).

However, for a number of reasons there are few individuals in the industry who understand this concept and can do the math the right way. That's why they make mistakes in the first place then overreact when they get hurt.

···

At 02:12 AM 8/15/2009, you wrote:

Concerning the loss of good games due to excessive play...

It would seem to me that in this day & age of the computer-controlled
comp system and networked machines on the floor the casino could easily
limit the damage a deranged pro or comp abuser is doing by simply
setting a software flag in the undesirable player's account that limits
the play or comps he gets on the machine. When the undesirable player
inserts his player's card the machine could either allow him to play but
not add any comp points, or not allow any play at all and spit out a
cashout ticket for any money he's inserted. Couldn't that be easily done
in software and wouldn't it be much simpler than human intervention
after the fact?

The computer could even monitor your play for a given period of time,
like your amount of play in 24 hours, and have it cutoff comp points
after a preset level that is deemed excessive. Why do they wait until
after someone greedily plays 14 hours a day for 2 weeks before taking
the game away from everyone? Just blacklist the offender in their comp
system, give him minimum or no comps and let everyone else keep playing.
They could even have the machine drop back to single coin play instead
of max coins. And pass the player's name & bio around so all casinos
could know this guy. There's all kind of limits that could be done to
the individual that is abusing the comp system. Granted, this wouldn't
help with players that don't use a card that are just playing for the
cash, but that's a much smaller group of abusers isn't it?

I think Nevada courts have consistently ruled that the casino has the
right to refuse/limit service to anyone.

Isn't this idea possible and more fair, allowing the good machines to be
available to the pro players that use moderation. And cheaper for the
casino, since they'd not have to take action after the fact. I'm not
against players making money off the casinos, but seems like more & more
we are all losing due to the actions of a few.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

------------------------------------

vpFREE Links: http://members.cox.net/vpfree/Links.htm

Yahoo! Groups Links

#3

Concerning the loss of good games due to excessive play...

"deranged pro or comp abuser" fits too close too home on this site for your idea to be workable. Many will criticize you for bring it up in full view of casino eyes. As a entertainment player, I have no stake in the type of play and the monitoring process.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

···

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "rokgpsman" <rokgpsman@...> wrote:

#4

your idea to be >workable. Many will criticize you for bring it up in
full view of casino eyes. As a entertainment >player, I have no stake in
the type of play and the monitoring process.
.

Perhaps so, but like a lot of criticism the ones that complain the
loudest are sometimes the biggest offenders. There are "pros" and
"advantage comp players" trying to make a living, these are fine & can
fit within the framework of the industry. But then there are the abusers
that cause overreaction from the gaming providers and then everyone
loses. Anyone that's played a machine for hours on end day after day
should take a hard look in the mirror before blaming the casinos for
removal of decent games.

I could be wrong but I'd bet a large number of people making a living
from casino advantage play would say privately (or publicly if they were
bold/honest) that it is the abusive advantage players that are a major
driver in wrecking the gaming opportunities for the others, not the
recreational players that play just a few hours per month/year or the
corporate bean counters. Unfortunately some knowledgeable players
selfishly want to get all they can possibly get before it goes away, at
the expense of future playing. They are afraid the machine will be gone
tomorrow so they hit it as hard as they can today, thus ensuring it will
be gone. A self-fulfilling prophecy. Pheasant hunters have a gamebird
limit for a reason - so there will be decent bird hunting next season.

As far as it being a new idea for casino to implement, it seems hard to
believe no professional casino software or IT dept anywhere has thought
about implementing in software some player comp restrictions based on
overuse or abuse of the system. Just about anything a human can monitor
manually can be done in software monitoring & analysis - I know this
from what we do where I work.

Thanks for the heads-up, I know it's a tough crowd here. But these are
the very people that have some of the biggest affect on the situation,
not Aunt Linda from Peoria that visits LV 2 or 3 times a year. And
people that affect their own destiny sometimes wreck it.

···

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "gilrus47" <gilrus47@...> wrote:

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "rokgpsman" rokgpsman@ wrote:

Concerning the loss of good games due to excessive play...

"deranged pro or comp abuser" fits too close too home on this site for