Just saw a news article that Caesars has hired a law firm to help it “restructure” its debt–which usually means bankruptcy. Does anyone know if this eventuality will negate Total Rewards points? My guess is yes.
Caesars Total Rewards points
They have been having a bit of an issue with the 2015 bond buyback. They did not get enough buyers and that might be the issue.
The Quad/Linc fiasco can’t be helping the situation.
AC Cheapie
The “debt restructuring” that has been underway since this spring is certainly being undertaken to avoid bankruptcy down the road. The business hasn’t turned as quickly as necessary for CZR to make good on debt that matures in 2015.
For the time being, CZR is solvent, and CZR and its debt holders have good reason to keep things afloat.
The most recent news article, which involves taking on some legal help, has to to with a related measure taken a couple of months ago, in which some properties were transferred to another CZR entity in exchange for a cash buyout, funded by an additional infusion from its buyout partners.
This transfer of assets, which will no longer back CZR debt, has made some debtholders nervous and they fear they may have got a raw deal. They’ve brought suit against CZR, and CZR has hired outside counsel to defend itself.
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All of the transactions surrounding the CZR buyout are unusually complex and have led some to easy speculation that CZR is in trouble.
Personally, while things have not gone swimmingly since the buyout (particularly the economy), I’m still optimistic that CZR will come out whole and strong in the end.
—In vpF…@…com, <gander7038@…> wrote :
Just saw a news article that Caesars has hired a law firm to help it “restructure” its debt–which usually means bankruptcy. Does anyone know if this eventuality will negate Total Rewards points? My guess is yes.
I was pissed when CZR got booted out of the Boston casino proposals. Our “virgin” gaming commission is getting beaten-up by the big leaguers. They saw something that shocked them. Might be our puritan roots or CZR did something really bad. CZR left very quickly and quietly.
That seems like a bizarre thread hijack … in any case, strong indication that CZR pulled out because of blatant signs of bias against it by MA gaming commission chair, and that MA didn’t surface anything not already known.
—In vpF…@…com, <haaljo@…> wrote :
I was pissed when CZR got booted out of the Boston casino proposals. Our “virgin” gaming commission is getting beaten-up by the big leaguers. They saw something that shocked them. Might be our puritan roots or CZR did something really bad. CZR left very quickly and quietly.
I’ve never heard of a bankruptcy reorganization to wipe out a reward program points. There have been many (remember all the airlines a few years ago) and they always preserve the customers reward program accounts in order to retain the customers. It could happen but very unlikely. With local 15X point multiplier days we both carry large rcs balances, but I’m not worried.
Dave
Gander,
About 2009, was advised by CPA/APVP friend to take only cash for wins at Harrahs and keep TR points low.
Easy enough to do. He hasn’t changed his mind.
We were both 7* back-in-the-day. He still is. Math works for him in CA. Not for me in Boston.
For VP players, bankruptcy might be a good thing. Name change; new management; clean slate on reputation and junk bonds. Bring in Michael Gaughan. Use his South Point casino as the model.
I’ve sat down next to several different players at Rincon that carry 8-figure RC balances. One explained that he accumulated nearly all of them in October 2010 when Rincon did 10x for the entire month (and still had 9/6 JoB at denominations up to $25). Told me he’d bought a car and done a $30k kitchen remodel with RC so far but still had the 8-figure balance.
Takes a lot of trust to maintain that kind of balance. More than I’d have.
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On Jul 12, 2014, at 7:54 AM, “haa…@…com [vpFREE]” <vpF…@…com> wrote:
Gander,
About 2009, was advised by CPA/APVP friend to take only cash for wins at Harrahs and keep TR points low.
Easy enough to do. He hasn’t changed his mind.
We were both 7* back-in-the-day. He still is. Math works for him in CA. Not for me in Boston.
For VP players, bankruptcy might be a good thing. Name change; new management; clean slate on reputation and junk bonds. Bring in Michael Gaughan. Use his South Point casino as the model.
For years now frequent CET players have been told (some members of this board included in the group) to zero out RC balance , charge to room and then let the host pick it up.
I was told this by a host at Revel when they down graded their comps in January.I told him no way I’m not "begging’ at the end of my trip only to find out “…oh we can pick up this but can’t do anything about that…” Shortly thereafter I zeroed out my balance with some jewelry purchases for gf and left Revel.
I know that Wynn works this “old system” and that’s one of several reasons I won’t play there.
Larry F.
Larry,
Revel benefits even more than CZR to name change, new management, clean slate on junk bonds and reputation. It’s image beckons the wrong income brackets. Comments in recent newspaper articles bear that out.
And New Jersey got to give A.C. something to differentiate itself. Thinking out-of-the-box is needed.
I too don’t like begging. Been there done that. South Point’s model.is exemplary. Free play or cash-back or comps @.25%. The host takes care of the room and then we’re on our own.
Bring in Michael Gaughan. Use his South Point casino as the model and a twist from the State of New Jersey. Something that could be done right away at low cost.for all the joints especially Harrahs and Revel.
And Gaughan would be good for us video poker players looking for a fair bet.
Dave in Boston
“And Gaughan would be good for us video poker players looking for a fair bet.”
Pretty sure the dozen or so APs that had their South Point accounts taken away because they were only playing good games on multipliers days will disagree with that statement.
I’m sure of that. I was there. Talking about not keeping a low profile. So obvious. Two machines at a time. Pulling out a wad of Benjamins to replenish a colleagues bankroll…
Sorry Harry- I’ll hi-jack it a little more- wasn’t CZR told there was an issue with one of the Gansvoort(sp?) owners? Maybe that was the story that used by MA to turn them away, but there isn’t a Gansvoort hotel in Vegas now- just a Cromwell (no relation). Might have actually been a fire behind that smoke.
Thanks, Lee.
If what an AP is doing is obvious or not from immediate appearance or from looking at their results over years, I just don’t think the following policy is an examplary model of a “fair bet.”
Let’s put in machines that can be beat in conjunction with our promotions. Let’s offer free classes that will lay out how to identify the opportunities and teach people how to play those machines correctly. That way we can give people the impression that we are more tolerant of winners and intelligence. Of course, if we get the impression that someone can actually pull it off, we need to take their card away.
I kind of feel I should clarify my post. I’m not making an argument for or against casino countermeasures against AP. All I’m saying is that I don’t see how the South Point policy of offering beatable opportunities, but excluding people they feel can beat them is any different from the policy of other casinos. So I’m wondering what makes their policy “exemplary.”
Basically the Suncoast put in opportunities and 86’d people they thought might capitalize. Other casinos put in blackjack with beatable rules and refuse the action of people they think could capitalize. Even stations put in over 100% machines, but will back off people that capitalize on larger denomination opportunies. I don’t see much difference in any of these policies from what South Point does. And I think a lot of people have complained that the policies in this current paragraph are unfair (I’m not making any statement as to whether they are fair or not). What makes the South Point policy so much more fair?
We watched the antics at the South Point NSUD 100 plays, that double points day from the seafood restaurant . Musical chairs, relay race and 100 yard dashes. One person flamboyantly pulls out a wad of Benjamin’s to replenish another’s bankroll.
Keep a low profile. Give them the same amount of action the day before or after. Play early morning .Stuff like that.
Putting Gaughan in charge of CZR or Revel would be a clash of cultures.