Bob Dancer's LVA Column - 2016
How Do I Answer?
http://www.lasvegasadvisor.com/bob_dancer/2016/0301.cfm
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The correct answer to her question was Yes.
This was obviously mot a serious player, simply because a serious player would not need to ask the question in the first place.
This was simply a person with a modicum of skill, who wanted to know the most important changes to the game in order to play for a while. I doubt that by playing the game using basic strategy for Jacks or better except drawing to inside straights would cost you more than 1/4 of a percent and that would be acceptable for any casual player.
Regards
A.P.
________________________________
From: "vpFREE3355 vpfree3355@gmail.com [vpFREE]" <vpFREE@yahoogroups.com>
To: vpFREE@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, March 1, 2016 12:57 PM
Subject: [vpFREE] Bob Dancer's LVA
Bob Dancer's LVA Column - 2016
How Do I Answer?
http://www.lasvegasadvisor.com/bob_dancer/2016/0301.cfm
*************************************************
This link is posted for informational purposes
and doesn't constitute an endorsement or approval
of the linked article's content by vpFREE. Any
discussion of the article must be done in
accordance with vpFREE's rules and policies.
*************************************************
---In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, <ehpee@...> wrote :
"...I doubt that by playing the game using basic strategy for Jacks or better except drawing to inside straights would cost you more than 1/4 of a percent and that would be acceptable for any casual player. "
Agree, and it's probably a good bit less than 1/4 of a percent. If you play 9/6 Bonus Poker Deluxe with a perfect 9/6 JOB strategy, it reduces the EV from 99.64% to 99.61%.
These kind of calcs are easy to do. You just need a pay table with hand frequencies accurate to 5 significant figures. These kinds of tables can be found in VPW, DRA-VP, and WinPoker, among others. To analyze the question in Bob's column, you'd just start with a table of 9/6 JOB frequencies and change the Quad pay from 25 to 80 and the 2-pair pay from 2 to 1. Then multiply each pay times its corresponding frequency and add up the 10 terms. Your answer should be 99.61%.
--Dunbar
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Thanks for making the point even more obvious. Anyone asking the question doesn't want an answer that tells them how to be perfect. They just want something simple to give them a better chance.
In Blackjack it would be like someone asking you if they should split a pair and you tell them all about learning how to count down an 8 deck shoe.
By the way there used to be a website that gave you the EV's of a lot of games when using other strategies. I just can't find it right now.
Regards
A.P.
________________________________
From: "h_dunbar@hotmail.com [vpFREE]" <vpFREE@yahoogroups.com>
To: vpFREE@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, March 1, 2016 4:47 PM
Subject: Re: [vpFREE] Bob Dancer's LVA
---In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, <ehpee@...> wrote :
"...I doubt that by playing the game using basic strategy for Jacks or better except drawing to inside straights would cost you more than 1/4 of a percent and that would be acceptable for any casual player. "
Agree, and it's probably a good bit less than 1/4 of a percent. If you play 9/6 Bonus Poker Deluxe with a perfect 9/6 JOB strategy, it reduces the EV from 99.64% to 99.61%.
These kind of calcs are easy to do. You just need a pay table with hand frequencies accurate to 5 significant figures. These kinds of tables can be found in VPW, DRA-VP, and WinPoker, among others. To analyze the question in Bob's column, you'd just start with a table of 9/6 JOB frequencies and change the Quad pay from 25 to 80 and the 2-pair pay from 2 to 1. Then multiply each pay times its corresponding frequency and add up the 10 terms. Your answer should be 99.61%.
--Dunbar
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Albert Pearson wrote:
By the way there used to be a website that gave you the EV's of a lot of
games when using other strategies. I just can't find it right now.
That's 5-cards site which is bookmarked in vpFREE Links.
http://www.videopokerhelp.net/wrong_strat.html
vpFREE Administrator
That's the one. Thanks.
Regards
A.P.
________________________________
From: "vpFREE3355 vpfree3355@gmail.com [vpFREE]" <vpFREE@yahoogroups.com>
To: vpFREE@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, March 1, 2016 8:19 PM
Subject: Re: [vpFREE] Bob Dancer's LVA
Albert Pearson wrote:
By the way there used to be a website that gave you the EV's of a lot of
games when using other strategies. I just can't find it right now.
That's 5-cards site which is bookmarked in vpFREE Links.
http://www.videopokerhelp.net/wrong_strat.html
vpFREE Administrator
There's some good stuff in this column about asserting yourself when someone is breaking your concentration by chatting you up. On a promo day like Bob described, you don't have the option of just slowing down or stopping completely, without doing yourself financial harm. But if you keep going full blast without shutting down the talker, you're much more likely to make mistakes. If you're a pro, your only option is to quickly get the person to understand that you can't talk right now. Bob's friend didn't get the message the first time, so he said it much more forcefully the second time. If the friend is offended, you can always make it up to them later, when the explanation isn't costing you money.
--Dunbar
---In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, <vpfree3355@...> wrote :
Bob Dancer's LVA Column - 2016
How Do I Answer?
http://www.lasvegasadvisor.com/bob_dancer/2016/0301.cfm
*************************************************
This link is posted for informational purposes
and doesn't constitute an endorsement or approval
of the linked article's content by vpFREE. Any
discussion of the article must be done in
accordance with vpFREE's rules and policies.
*************************************************
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
I should have noted that the "easy" calc I outlined can only be done when the 2 games have the same payout categories, which is the case for JOB and BPD. You could not, however, use this method to find the cost of using JOB strategy while playing a DDB game, because DDB has separate payouts for different quad ranks. For a calc like getting the cost of using JOB strategy to play DDB, a dedicated feature like DanP described in OpVP is especially useful.
--Dunbar
---In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, <h_dunbar@...> wrote :
...These kind of calcs are easy to do. You just need a pay table with hand frequencies accurate to 5 significant figures. These kinds of tables can be found in VPW, DRA-VP, and WinPoker, among others. To analyze the question in Bob's column, you'd just start with a table of 9/6 JOB frequencies and change the Quad pay from 25 to 80 and the 2-pair pay from 2 to 1. Then multiply each pay times its corresponding frequency and add up the 10 terms. Your answer should be 99.61%.
--Dunbar
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Don't sell yourself short, Dunbar 
You can get the respective "JB strategy" hand frequencies for DDB simply using a program like WinPoker: Pull up DDB and load the paytable with the corresponding values for JB (all quads are 25, etc). Then simply proceed as you suggest in your first post.
---In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, <h_dunbar@...> wrote :
I should have noted that the "easy" calc I outlined can only be done when the 2 games have the same payout categories, which is the case for JOB and BPD. You could not, however, use this method to find the cost of using JOB strategy while playing a DDB game, because DDB has separate payouts for different quad ranks. For a calc like getting the cost of using JOB strategy to play DDB, a dedicated feature like DanP described in OpVP is especially useful.
–Dunbar
—In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com mailto:vpF…@…com, <h_dunbar@…> wrote :
...These kind of calcs are easy to do. You just need a pay table with hand frequencies accurate to 5 significant figures. These kinds of tables can be found in VPW, DRA-VP, and WinPoker, among others. To analyze the question in Bob's column, you'd just start with a table of 9/6 JOB frequencies and change the Quad pay from 25 to 80 and the 2-pair pay from 2 to 1. Then multiply each pay times its corresponding frequency and add up the 10 terms. Your answer should be 99.61%.
--Dunbar
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Harry, what you're suggesting will give you the cost of playing JOB with DDB strategy, but not the cost of playing DDB with JOB strategy, which is the example I was using.
One might intuitively think that there would be some symmetry in the cost, but that's not the case. I just now used DRA-VP to see the effect of using 100.76% DW strategy to play 99.73% NSUD and vice versa.
If you play 100.76% DW using NSUD strategy, it costs 0.44%. (payback becomes 100.32%)
If you play 99.73% NSUD using full-pay DW strategy, it costs 0.92%. (payback becomes 98.81%)
So, you clearly can't use the cost in one direction to estimate the cost in the opposite direction.
--Dunbar
---In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, <harry.porter@...> wrote :
Don't sell yourself short, Dunbar
You can get the respective "JB strategy" hand frequencies for DDB simply using a program like WinPoker: Pull up DDB and load the paytable with the corresponding values for JB (all quads are 25, etc). Then simply proceed as you suggest in your first post.
—In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com mailto:vpF…@…com, <h_dunbar@…> wrote :
I should have noted that the "easy" calc I outlined can only be done when the 2 games have the same payout categories, which is the case for JOB and BPD. You could not, however, use this method to find the cost of using JOB strategy while playing a DDB game, because DDB has separate payouts for different quad ranks. For a calc like getting the cost of using JOB strategy to play DDB, a dedicated feature like DanP described in OpVP is especially useful.
–Dunbar
—In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com mailto:vpF…@…com mailto:vpF…@…com, <h_dunbar@…> wrote :
...These kind of calcs are easy to do. You just need a pay table with hand frequencies accurate to 5 significant figures. These kinds of tables can be found in VPW, DRA-VP, and WinPoker, among others. To analyze the question in Bob's column, you'd just start with a table of 9/6 JOB frequencies and change the Quad pay from 25 to 80 and the 2-pair pay from 2 to 1. Then multiply each pay times its corresponding frequency and add up the 10 terms. Your answer should be 99.61%.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]