vpFREE2 Forums

Belterra Update

#1

I just got back from Belterra Casino in Indiana. An unusual thing
happened WHILE I was playing their 9/6 50 play JOB. When I started
playing I was earning one point for each $8 of action I put through
the machine, as I had done several times before. After a couple of
hours of play on this the machine IT CHANGED and only rewarded a
point after each $14.70 of play or so. I asked at the players club
about this and was told that they are changing the way points are
earned now and many variables are considered before a point is
awarded. She said the machine, amount, speed, and other things are
considered now but could not give me details about HOW they are
considered now.

I was pretty upset that they decided to make this change without
informing players in any way that I could see. The boothling told me
they were not informing people about the changes unless they asked.
The change seemed to take effect around 9am May 1. At least that is
when my machine went to the "new" system. So now the .125% cashback
falls to .068% .....hardly worth the trouble to keep track of now. I
did not check what the cashback was for other VP games.....they could
be different, but on the 50 play JOB it sure went down from marginal
to miniamal. It was also upsetting for this change to take effect
DURING a session and WITHOUT WARNING.

Good luck to all.

#2

Ahhh, yes, good ol' Indiana gaming. Other than the
crappy CB rate, how was the JOB? I ask because I have
my suspicions about VP in Indiana.

···

--- toddr54 <toddgone@aol.com> wrote:

I just got back from Belterra Casino in Indiana. An
unusual thing
happened WHILE I was playing their 9/6 50 play JOB.
When I started
playing I was earning one point for each $8 of
action I put through
the machine, as I had done several times before.
After a couple of
hours of play on this the machine IT CHANGED and
only rewarded a
point after each $14.70 of play or so. I asked at
the players club
about this and was told that they are changing the
way points are
earned now and many variables are considered before
a point is
awarded. She said the machine, amount, speed, and
other things are
considered now but could not give me details about
HOW they are
considered now.

I was pretty upset that they decided to make this
change without
informing players in any way that I could see. The
boothling told me
they were not informing people about the changes
unless they asked.
The change seemed to take effect around 9am May 1.
At least that is
when my machine went to the "new" system. So now the
.125% cashback
falls to .068% .....hardly worth the trouble to
keep track of now. I
did not check what the cashback was for other VP
games.....they could
be different, but on the 50 play JOB it sure went
down from marginal
to miniamal. It was also upsetting for this change
to take effect
DURING a session and WITHOUT WARNING.

Good luck to all.

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

#3

Other than the changing cashback I thought the 9/6 JOB 50 play game
played fine. I have played the same bank of machines and have always
found it that way. Today I walked away with a small win after about
3.5 hours of play.

···

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, Charles Martin <tangboy5000@...> wrote:

Ahhh, yes, good ol' Indiana gaming. Other than the
crappy CB rate, how was the JOB? I ask because I have
my suspicions about VP in Indiana.

--- toddr54 <toddgone@...> wrote:

> I just got back from Belterra Casino in Indiana. An
> unusual thing
> happened WHILE I was playing their 9/6 50 play JOB.
> When I started
> playing I was earning one point for each $8 of
> action I put through
> the machine, as I had done several times before.
> After a couple of
> hours of play on this the machine IT CHANGED and
> only rewarded a
> point after each $14.70 of play or so. I asked at
> the players club
> about this and was told that they are changing the
> way points are
> earned now and many variables are considered before
> a point is
> awarded. She said the machine, amount, speed, and
> other things are
> considered now but could not give me details about
> HOW they are
> considered now.
>
> I was pretty upset that they decided to make this
> change without
> informing players in any way that I could see. The
> boothling told me
> they were not informing people about the changes
> unless they asked.
> The change seemed to take effect around 9am May 1.
> At least that is
> when my machine went to the "new" system. So now the
> .125% cashback
> falls to .068% .....hardly worth the trouble to
> keep track of now. I
> did not check what the cashback was for other VP
> games.....they could
> be different, but on the 50 play JOB it sure went
> down from marginal
> to miniamal. It was also upsetting for this change
> to take effect
> DURING a session and WITHOUT WARNING.
>
> Good luck to all.
>
>
>
>

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

#4

The 2005 World Series of Poker Consumer Retail Show
announced

The 2005 WSOP Consumer Retail Show was created to
offer fans and players the chance to meet with vendors
from around the world. For vendors, it is a unique
opportunity to reach a built-in audience of thousands
of professional poker players, as well as thousands of
poker fans interested in expanding their knowledge of
an exciting lifestyle.

The show is sponsored by Harrah's Entertainment, Inc.
It will be held on the Rio Pavilion at the Rio
All-Suite Hotel and Casino in Las Vegas, Nevada.

The consumer show coincides with the first rounds of
the WSOP on July 6 from 11 am to 6 pm and July 7-9
from 10 am through 6 pm.

The show is open to the public, but guests must be at
least 21 years old to attend.

If you are interested in showing your products to
players and fans at poker's biggest event, send an
email to:
wsopconsumershow@lvrio.harrahs.com

···

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

#5

Oops, worng dates!!! July 27-30

http://www.worldseriesofpoker.com/gaminglifeexpo.asp

···

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

#6

Really? IN was only the best place in the USA to play VP from
2000-2003...know quite a few 7-figure winners in that time span there.

···

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, Charles Martin <tangboy5000@...> wrote:

Ahhh, yes, good ol' Indiana gaming. Other than the
crappy CB rate, how was the JOB? I ask because I have
my suspicions about VP in Indiana.

_________________________________________________________________________

paladingaming.net

#7

I'm not saying it's bad, there are just some odd
things that I've observed. I went through $400 on
quarter DW without hitting anything better than a
straight. Sometimes it feels like they flip a switch.
Mornings are completely different from night time
from what I've observed, especially on the
progressives. I've never hit anything big on a draw.
All my big wins have come from dealt hands...SF, RF
etc.. and all were in the evening, never in the
morning.

--- paladingamingllc <paladingamingllc@yahoo.com>
wrote:

···

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, Charles Martin
<tangboy5000@...> wrote:
>
> Ahhh, yes, good ol' Indiana gaming. Other than
the
> crappy CB rate, how was the JOB? I ask because I
have
> my suspicions about VP in Indiana.

Really? IN was only the best place in the USA to
play VP from
2000-2003...know quite a few 7-figure winners in
that time span there.

_________________________________________________________________________

paladingaming.net

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

#8

I just got back from Belterra Casino in Indiana. An unusual thing
happened WHILE I was playing their 9/6 50 play JOB. When I started
playing I was earning one point for each $8 of action I put

through

···

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "toddr54" <toddgone@...> wrote:

the machine, as I had done several times before. After a couple of
hours of play on this the machine IT CHANGED and only rewarded a
point after each $14.70 of play or so. I asked at the players club
about this and was told that they are changing the way points are
earned now and many variables are considered before a point is
awarded.

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
   I have emailed my host at Belterra to check on this. I will post
any info I receive.
   Over the past few months, Belterra has been reducing their BBC
and multiple cash back days. They have just about eliminated their
multiple point days. So this change in coin-in requirement wouldn't
surprise me.
   On the other hand, I wouldn't believe anything the booth
population told me about policy. And Belterra's computers have been
known to screw up. Also, since Grand Victoria recently reduced
their CI requirement to the same as slots (i.e., $4 CI = one point)
it seems odd that Belterra would make their CB that much worse than
a neighboring casino.
Dan

#9

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, Charles Martin <tangboy5000@...>
wrote:

···

I'm not saying it's bad, there are just some odd
things that I've observed. I went through $400 on
quarter DW without hitting anything better than a
straight. Sometimes it feels like they flip a switch.
Mornings are completely different from night time
from what I've observed, especially on the
progressives. I've never hit anything big on a draw.
All my big wins have come from dealt hands...SF, RF
etc.. and all were in the evening, never in the
morning.

--- paladingamingllc <paladingamingllc@...>
wrote:

> --- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, Charles Martin
> <tangboy5000@> wrote:
> >
> > Ahhh, yes, good ol' Indiana gaming. Other than
> the
> > crappy CB rate, how was the JOB? I ask because I
> have
> > my suspicions about VP in Indiana.
>
> Really? IN was only the best place in the USA to
> play VP from
> 2000-2003...know quite a few 7-figure winners in
> that time span there.
>
>

_____________________________________________________________________
____

>
> paladingaming.net

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
   I've played alot of VP at Belterra over the last two years.
Almost all of it has been 9/6 JOB. I've kept copious notes,
especially of the STP machines because I didn't think they were
hitting the multiplier as frequently as expected.
   I've had some big losing streaks, but I no longer think the
machines are rigged. I think the machines are fair, but sometimes I
think the VP gods are against me.
Dan

#10
#11

It used to be at Magestic Star, IN for a few months.

I have played for two years solid at Belterra and after a million
dollars of coin on the 50/100 plays I am 0.15% behind of the
expected return. I am putting this down to strategy lapses.

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "paladingamingllc"
<paladingamingllc@...> wrote:

···

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "sechkardan" <sechkar@> wrote:

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

> I've played alot of VP at Belterra over the last two years.
> Almost all of it has been 9/6 JOB. I've kept copious notes,

> especially of the STP machines because I didn't think they were
> hitting the multiplier as frequently as expected.
> I've had some big losing streaks, but I no longer think the
> machines are rigged. I think the machines are fair, but

sometimes I

> think the VP gods are against me.

I had a day once playing STP where I lost two royals after hitting
one; I remember a couple of similar stories. There was the
Chicago-area couple last year, where in the morning the husband was
drawing live to $320K with one to go (missed it, and everything

else

on the draw), but his wife came through in the evening for $120K.

The

volatility of the game is staggering, if you ask me. Here's a

thought:

which game is more volatile, STP Jacks or Super Aces? I don't even
think it's close.

Which reminds me, anyone out there ever see STP NSUD? Problem with

the

game is that it's 100.01, which limits where it could be offered.

If

it were 99.99, I'd bet a few casinos would offer it.

_____________________________________________________________________
_

paladingaming.net

#12

I didn't know that about the Grand Vic. That does
seem odd that the Belterra would do that.

···

--- sechkardan <sechkar@earthlink.net> wrote:

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "toddr54"
<toddgone@...> wrote:
>
> I just got back from Belterra Casino in Indiana.
An unusual thing
> happened WHILE I was playing their 9/6 50 play
JOB. When I started
> playing I was earning one point for each $8 of
action I put
through
> the machine, as I had done several times before.
After a couple of
> hours of play on this the machine IT CHANGED and
only rewarded a
> point after each $14.70 of play or so. I asked at
the players club
> about this and was told that they are changing the
way points are
> earned now and many variables are considered
before a point is
> awarded.

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

   I have emailed my host at Belterra to check on
this. I will post
any info I receive.
   Over the past few months, Belterra has been
reducing their BBC
and multiple cash back days. They have just about
eliminated their
multiple point days. So this change in coin-in
requirement wouldn't
surprise me.
   On the other hand, I wouldn't believe anything
the booth
population told me about policy. And Belterra's
computers have been
known to screw up. Also, since Grand Victoria
recently reduced
their CI requirement to the same as slots (i.e., $4
CI = one point)
it seems odd that Belterra would make their CB that
much worse than
a neighboring casino.
Dan

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

#13

Did you actually see the stp nsud at MS? I know one was listed in the
database, but I never saw it. I've never seen an stp nsud.

Chandler

···

-----Original Message-----
From: vpFREE@yahoogroups.com [mailto:vpF…@…com]On Behalf Of
kiwiboy4921
Sent: Tuesday, May 02, 2006 10:01 PM
To: vpFREE@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [vpFREE] Re: Belterra Update

It used to be at Magestic Star, IN for a few months.

#14

IN being a "100%" jurisdiction, it's highly unlikely that you'd see
STP NSUD there. Perhaps the poster had it confused with MS NSUD
(99.92), which was offered at Majestic, as well as MS DBDW (single
line only, 99.96).

···

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Chandler" <omnibibulous1@...> wrote:

Did you actually see the stp nsud at MS? I know one was listed in the
database, but I never saw it. I've never seen an stp nsud.

Chandler

-----Original Message-----
From: vpFREE@yahoogroups.com [mailto:vpF…@…com]On Behalf Of
kiwiboy4921
Sent: Tuesday, May 02, 2006 10:01 PM
To: vpFREE@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [vpFREE] Re: Belterra Update

It used to be at Magestic Star, IN for a few months.

______________________________________________________________________

paladingaming.net

#15

I never did play the machines (they were gone when I arrived).
Paladin could be right the initial post could have been mistake or it
could have been MS NSUD.

Cheers

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "paladingamingllc"
<paladingamingllc@...> wrote:

>
> Did you actually see the stp nsud at MS? I know one was listed in the
> database, but I never saw it. I've never seen an stp nsud.
>
> Chandler
>
> From: vpFREE@yahoogroups.com [mailto:vpF…@…com]On

Behalf Of

···

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Chandler" <omnibibulous1@> wrote:
> -----Original Message-----
> kiwiboy4921
> Sent: Tuesday, May 02, 2006 10:01 PM
> To: vpFREE@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [vpFREE] Re: Belterra Update
>
>
> It used to be at Magestic Star, IN for a few months.

IN being a "100%" jurisdiction, it's highly unlikely that you'd see
STP NSUD there. Perhaps the poster had it confused with MS NSUD
(99.92), which was offered at Majestic, as well as MS DBDW (single
line only, 99.96).

______________________________________________________________________

paladingaming.net

#16

>
> I just got back from Belterra Casino in Indiana. An unusual

thing

> happened WHILE I was playing their 9/6 50 play JOB. When I

started

> playing I was earning one point for each $8 of action I put
through
> the machine, as I had done several times before. After a couple

of

> hours of play on this the machine IT CHANGED and only rewarded a
> point after each $14.70 of play or so. I asked at the players

club

> about this and was told that they are changing the way points

are

···

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "sechkardan" <sechkar@...> wrote:

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "toddr54" <toddgone@> wrote:
> earned now and many variables are considered before a point is
> awarded.

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

   I have emailed my host at Belterra to check on this. I will

post

any info I receive.
   Over the past few months, Belterra has been reducing their BBC
and multiple cash back days. They have just about eliminated

their

multiple point days. So this change in coin-in requirement

wouldn't

surprise me.
   On the other hand, I wouldn't believe anything the booth
population told me about policy. And Belterra's computers have

been

known to screw up. Also, since Grand Victoria recently reduced
their CI requirement to the same as slots (i.e., $4 CI = one

point)

it seems odd that Belterra would make their CB that much worse

than

a neighboring casino.
Dan

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
   Well, looks like toddr54 and the booth people were correct.
   I just got some written information from Belterra that
states: "Starting May 1, the speed at which you accumulate points
will vary based on your speed of play, the amount you wager, how
long you play and on what particular type of slot machine you're
playing at the time." It goes on to state: "And in most cases,
you'll find your points accumulating faster, sometimes much faster
than you have experienced in the past or will have ever experienced
at any other casino in the area."
   I probably won't get to Belterra for a couple of weeks to check
this out in person. Has anyone else besides toddr54 played at
Belterra since May 1? If so, did anyone accumulate points faster
than the pre-May 1 rate of $8/point?
Dan