vpFREE2 Forums

20-Line Spin Poker

#1

I am interested in any feedback on the 20-Line (100 coin max bet) Spin
Poker game which I saw at Caesars with a few decent paytables. Not the
standard 9 Line version, but the 20.

As I understand how the lines pay, if you were dealt Four Aces, you
wouldn't necessarily win all 20 X the Four Aces payout because some of
the 20 lines take unusual jumps and turns to determine their five
cards. Has anybody figured this out mathematically? For example, would
the 95% return for Jacks or Better be increased or maybe, I suspect,
reduced by choosing this game?

Thanks for your input.

#2

The return of spin poker is the same as regular VP (all drawn cards
are picked identically).

I don't have any data about the variance, but I guess that it's lower
(per deal) than single-line VP and higher (per deal) than plain
20-line multi-line.

JBQ

···

On 12/7/05, npf125 <nps125@msn.com> wrote:

20-Line (100 coin max bet) Spin Poker [...]

#3

npf said: As I understand how the lines pay, if you were dealt Four
Aces, you
wouldn't necessarily win all 20 X the Four Aces payout because some of
the 20 lines take unusual jumps and turns to determine their five
cards.

This is not true. Let's say you were dealt aces in the first four
positions, and held them (of course). Holding those four cards
duplicates the hold in the first four positions on the top line and the
first four positions on the bottom line. (I'm assuming you did not hold
the fifth card. Obviously in some games it doesn't matter, and in other
games it would --- depending on whether the fifth card was a paying
kicker or not).

Every one of the 20 pay lines goes through exactly one of the three
cards in the first position --- exactly one of the cards in the second
position --- exactly one of the cards in the third position --- and
exactly one of the cards in the fifth position. Since EACH of the three
cards in every position has the same cards in it as the other two cards
in the same position, every one of the pay lines here would give you
four aces.

In the fifth position, you'll find three different cards. Since 20
paylines are going through three positions, the "average" is 6.67 pay
lines through each position, but in actuality it is either 6 or 7. This
can matter. You'd prefer to get 7 kicker hands to 6, of course. I
haven't looked at the pattern recently, but in the center position,
there are something like 9 pay lines going through it, offset by 5 or 6
on the squares directly above or below.

I think there are 1,296 different possible lines if each line is
constrained to go through one of the three cards in the first position,
one in the second, one in the third, one in the fourth, and one in the
fifth. Although 20 lines covers a lot more than 9, we're not close to
spanning the space.

Bob Dancer

For the best in video poker information, visit www.bobdancer.com
or call 1-800-244-2224 M-F 9-5 Pacific Time.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

#4

From: "Bob Dancer" <bob.dancer@compdance.com>

I think there are 1,296 different possible lines if each line is
constrained to go through one of the three cards in the first position,
one in the second, one in the third, one in the fourth, and one in the
fifth.

Uh, no, that would be 3^5 or 243 different possible lines.

···

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#5

Bob Dancer

For the best in video poker information, visit www.bobdancer.com
or call 1-800-244-2224 M-F 9-5 Pacific Time.

I wrote: I think there are 1,296 different possible lines if each line
is
   constrained to go through one of the three cards in the first
position,
   one in the second, one in the third, one in the fourth, and one in
the
   fifth.

Part timer corrected: Uh, no, that would be 3^5 or 243 different
possible lines.

My response: I still think my number, which is 6^4 is correct. Label the
squares in the first two positions as

    A D
    B E
    C F

In case the columns don't line up for you on email, I have A B C in the
first column and D E F in the second.

There are six ways to have lines go from first column to the second,
namely:

    1. AD, BE, CF
    2. AD, BF, CE
    3. AE, BD, BF
    4. AE, BF, CD
    5. AF, BD, CE
    6. AF, BE, CD

Each of these six ways may be matched up with the six ways to go from
column 2 to 3 --- and six ways to go from 3 to 4 --- and six ways to go
from 4 to 5. So I think it is 6 * 6 * 6 * 6 = 1,296

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

#6

It does not matter how many ways you can have the lines go from first
column to the second simulatneously. AD is AD whether it is "paired"
with BE/CF or BF/CE. All that matters is the number of combinations
of items in the first column with items in the second column.

Using just your 2 columns, you can have 9 lines -- AD, AE, AF, BD, BE,
BF, CD, CE, CF.

If we make it a 3 column game, we get 27 possible lines:

   A D G
   B E H
   C F I

ADG, ADH, ADI, AEG, AEH, AEI, AFG, AFH, AFI, BDG, BDH, BDI, BEG, BEH,
BEI, BFG, BFH, BFI, CDG, CDH, CDI, CEG, CEH, CEI, CFG, CFH, and CFI.

Adding a 4th column gives 81 possible lines; with 5 columns, there are
243 possible lines. The number of possible left-to-right lines is
always Lines = Rows^Columns.

Ken

···

--- In vpFREE@yahoogroups.com, "Bob Dancer" <bob.dancer@c...> wrote:

My response: I still think my number, which is 6^4 is correct. Label the
squares in the first two positions as

    A D
    B E
    C F

In case the columns don't line up for you on email, I have A B C in the
first column and D E F in the second.

There are six ways to have lines go from first column to the second,
namely:

    1. AD, BE, CF
    2. AD, BF, CE
    3. AE, BD, BF
    4. AE, BF, CD
    5. AF, BD, CE
    6. AF, BE, CD

Each of these six ways may be matched up with the six ways to go from
column 2 to 3 --- and six ways to go from 3 to 4 --- and six ways to go
from 4 to 5. So I think it is 6 * 6 * 6 * 6 = 1,296

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]