vpFREE2 Forums

Doubling uop

#21

That brings another point that someone else touched on. Do we know for sure that it is a random bet?

While I'm not a professor of math, I can think in mathematical terms and have other questions. As I understand the double up option, the dealer has one card and you have a choice of four cards.

Do we even know if a standard 52 card deck is used, as advertised for the regular part of the game? Could the dealer's card be programmed? Is the dealer's card a separate RNG? I'm very suspicious of any "free" bet that LV offers. They don't just do it because players want that option. They have a proven reason or it wouldn't be offered.

Allen

···

At 11:35 AM 10/6/02, you wrote:

Think about this, there are not many even money bets in LV

#22

The question is, how many players like the option? I've rarely

seen it, except at Chumash, where it seemed fairly popular. But two
thoughts:

Here in the midwest where the only nearby casino are owned by Native
Americans, I see lots of players doubling up. I have seen many get
off of a machine (or complain) that their machine will not double
up. Casual observation would lead one to conclude these are rather
casual video poker players. The ones you see put in a five dollar
bill on a quarter machine and then when they go broke they get up
and leave saying "This @#$%^&* machines never hits anything. Or
maybe the ones that run around with a bucket of coins and drop one
in while still standing and if they hit they double up and double
up and double up until they lose, then say darn. <G>

Deuceswild1000

#23

I'm very suspicious of any "free" bet that LV

offers. They don't just do it because players want that option. They have
a proven reason or it wouldn't be offered.

Allen<<

Amen!

lb

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#24

Casual observation would lead one to conclude these are rather

casual video poker players. <<

My guess is that you're probably right, and I see them in my imagination just as you described. <g>

But I'd still like to hear from someone who can explain if the random generator used for the double-up option is tweeked by the casino. Obviously it makes a big difference one way or the other.

lb

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#25

I'm very suspicious of any "free" bet that LV
offers. They don't just do it because players want that option. They

have

a proven reason or it wouldn't be offered.

Allen

Amen!

lb

  Since the game uses a 52 card deck, it is governed by the exact
laws that govern all VP in Nevada (or any other jurisdiction for that
matter).

  Furthermore, the casinos spend LOTS of money to get people to
come in and play. If putting a double up option on a game makes
people play longer (because they have more FUN) the casino will do it.

  Finally, the casino management might actually be ignorant of
the reality of the math and believe that the added variance and
therefore the increased chance of winning all the money a customer
has in his/her pockets actually helps them make more money in the
long run.

  This logic that says... "If the casino does it, it must be
to their advantage" is just not valid. It is certainly their
intent to have everything they do contribute to their bottom line,
but that is very different from actually achieving that result.
and very different from making money from every customer.

  QZ

#26

"free" bet, what does that mean??

win......and then bet double or nothing, how can that be "free"???

Tom

···

On 6 Oct 2002 at 18:01, Lawrence Boxer wrote:

>>I'm very suspicious of any "free" bet that LV
offers. They don't just do it because players want that option. They have
a proven reason or it wouldn't be offered.

Allen<<

Amen!

lb

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#27

Doubling-up, though, is strictly chance, unless someone is going to argue that clairvoyance is a skill :wink: <<

Excellent point. Still to be addressed, however, is the question of seperate random number generators for the double-up options, and whether or not they can be adjusted by the casino for limited return. Even assuming a fair game, BV's point stands.

Seems to me that success depends on pure play, infused with some good luck. These vartious options add a little too much luck and detract from the pure play.

lb

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#28

I like all the discussion on doubling, but still can not see how it
would end up being a 50/50 chance? I thought that it would change
according to what ever card that was turned up for the dealer, if a
52 card deck is used. ( if dealer gets a ACE then you would have 3
cards out of 51 to tie and out of 51 cards you only get to pick 1 out
of 4 ? )

Jacob

ps. know there is a lot more math involved but just trying to keep it
short

#29

It's 50/50 before you make the bet. It is 50/50 because the house has no edge in the game. They pick a card , you pick a card , high card wins, and a tie is a push, that is a 50/50 proposition.
Even if you look at it after the deal it is 50/50 in the long run, for every Ace that the house draws, they will also draw a deuce, that will equalise things.

Regards
A.P.

···

----- Original Message -----
  From: Jacob
  To: vpFREE@yahoogroups.com
  Sent: Monday, October 07, 2002 1:32 PM
  Subject: [vpFREE] Re: Doubling up

  I like all the discussion on doubling, but still can not see how it
  would end up being a 50/50 chance? I thought that it would change
  according to what ever card that was turned up for the dealer, if a
  52 card deck is used. ( if dealer gets a ACE then you would have 3
  cards out of 51 to tie and out of 51 cards you only get to pick 1 out
  of 4 ? )

  Jacob

  ps. know there is a lot more math involved but just trying to keep it
  short

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]